[00:00:06] Speaker A: Hi, my name is Katie Malone, and.
[00:00:08] Speaker B: I'm Brendan the husband.
[00:00:09] Speaker A: And you're listening to the little flock, the podcast that offers practical insights about living a counterculture of goodness, truth, and beauty in a world of increasingly hostile secularism and indifference.
[00:00:19] Speaker B: So if you're looking to learn from two imperfect followers of Christ about how to live like the wheat amongst the Darnell, this is definitely the podcast for you.
Hi, everybody. Welcome along to another episode of the Little Flock. Katie.
[00:00:36] Speaker A: Welcome back, everybody.
[00:00:37] Speaker B: It's great to be back, isn't it?
[00:00:39] Speaker A: Yeah, it's been going quickly, I reckon.
[00:00:41] Speaker B: Man, it's crazy, eh? I was just about to say the wrong thing, too. I was so out of practice with this podcast.
[00:00:46] Speaker A: Are you going to say Merry Christmas or something?
[00:00:48] Speaker B: No.
Happy Hanukkah, everybody. It's Black Friday. No, I was going to introduce the wrong podcast.
[00:00:55] Speaker A: Too many podcasts. Yeah, how do you know you've got too many podcasts?
[00:00:59] Speaker B: That's definitely a sign.
Let me do some notices. So you just sit back, relax, and enjoy this part of the presentation, folks, if you're new here, welcome. Please share and subscribe. Let your friends know about the podcast if you find merit in it, and please give us a rating.
My wife is laughing in the background at my holy spirit hands. They're going your jazz hands. Go and listen to the last episode. You'll hear what the joke is there. But also, if your podcast platform you're listening on now allows you to do it, please give us a rating, some stars, a comment. All of that really, really helps the show if you want to support our ministry work. We're involved in a lot of important ministry work and we've got some really big changes coming this year. If you want to support that, there's two ways to do it. One is go to lifenet.org nz and you'll see the donate page there and you can become a regular donor. And if you're based in New Zealand, you can claim it back on your tax each year. The other way is to become a patron of our work at Foot media. The links for both of those will be in the show notes. And if you do it via Patreon, then there's been a big change there this year, Katie. Exciting. Oh, drum roll.
[00:02:09] Speaker A: Suspense.
[00:02:10] Speaker B: That's not a very good drum roll, is it?
[00:02:12] Speaker A: Needed a little sound effect you could press.
[00:02:14] Speaker B: Come on, man, this is not like that one.
What's happening there with the Patreon is previously we had a weekly patrons only podcast. So if you become a patron with $5 or more per month. That's it. Just $5. What does the cost of a cup of coffee now?
[00:02:31] Speaker A: Yeah, more than $5 these days, depending what kind of milk you like.
[00:02:34] Speaker B: Yeah, I couldn't believe it. I had a cup of tea this morning with a group of men and it was $5.60 for a cup of tea.
[00:02:41] Speaker A: You should have taken your flask.
[00:02:42] Speaker B: Well, it's just about.
[00:02:43] Speaker A: That's for hot water.
[00:02:43] Speaker B: Getting that bad shivers. The price of tea take a lot. Yeah, I'm turning into angry old man complaining about the price of tea bags. But yeah, if you become a patron with $5 or more per month, every day, there is a patrons only episode of the podcast. One of the big bit of the bit of feedback, one of the major bits of feedback that we've had come back to us over the last year is people say we love the content, but being able to consume in bite sized pieces is quite preferable for people. And so previously, the patrons only podcasts, sometimes they were up to 2 hours long, each twice a week.
[00:03:22] Speaker A: Too many opinions.
[00:03:22] Speaker B: Yeah, too many opinions, that boy. So what we've decided to do is, starting from this week, if you're a patron with $5 or more per month, you'll get a podcast that's between 20, maximum 40 minutes. Trying to aim somewhere between 20 and 30 minutes a day. And so it's a nice, consumable, bite sized piece of podcast that you can eat at your workout or on your daily walk or when you are, I don't know, doing all the chores that the children should have done.
[00:03:50] Speaker A: That's right.
[00:03:50] Speaker B: My poor wife. That's a bit of an inside joke at the moment, but yeah. Patreon.com left footmedia and those podcasts are focused on all sorts of issues around culture, current affairs, faith. Like today's episode is half hour episode on Lent and the history of Lent. And we're going to talk about Lent today actually in this episode. But there's a whole lot more in that podcast. So yeah. Patreon.com left foot media last two quick things. If you've got conversation topics or questions you would like us to answer, please send them via the littleflockpodcast.org and you'll see when you go there, there's a button you can press on a little form to fill out or lifenet.org nz again, you'll see the banner at the top of the page. You can't miss it. And you can send us your questions and suggestions that way. Now this is the big announcement for this year. Katie, the forge. The forge is coming.
[00:04:47] Speaker A: Tell us about the forge.
[00:04:48] Speaker B: Brennan oh, thank you. I. Will someone light the fires, please? Because the fires will be lit this year. The forge is going to be an online video formation site and other video content that's really about, as the byline of the website says, it's about shaping lives in the fires of goodness, truth and beauty. And a lot of my formation presentations that I get asked to give at conferences and around the country and different events, they will be available there for you. We're going to set them up so that they are deliberately structured so that they're 15 to 20 minutes per video. So like a 1 hour presentation will be broken down into three parts so that you could actually watch them with a small group in your church, for example. And there'll be some guided questions if you want to do it that way. Or you could watch the whole thing as an individual all in one hit. So it's really designed for people to actually sharpen and grow in their formation. And there's going to be other great content coming, too. We have already got someone who has committed to being on the forge. We're really excited about this. We're going to film a ten hour formation series on the book of the apocalypse, the Book of Revelation. So that's going to be available exclusively on the Forge. So theforge.org nz go there now. There's a splash page. You can leave your email address and you'll find out when that's live.
[00:06:07] Speaker A: That's a lot of advertising.
[00:06:09] Speaker B: That is a lot, isn't it?
[00:06:10] Speaker A: Gosh, we should have like a skip intro.
[00:06:12] Speaker B: Well, yeah, if you want the actual podcast, there's two minutes at the end, 20 minutes of plugging and advertising and pleading for support. Okay, let's get into it then. Let's just cut all the noise. Katie. Yeah, I hear you. Cut the rubbish. Lent tomorrow? No, well, today, actually, because we're publishing this. We're pre recording it on Tuesday, shrove Tuesday. But we are publishing this on Ash Wednesday. It is the start of Lent. The 40 days in the western church. It's different for the eastern church, but between Ash Wednesday and Easter Sunday. So seven weeks leading up to Easter. And if you're good at maths, you can already tell. Hot on.
[00:06:55] Speaker A: That's not 40 days. So why is.
[00:06:57] Speaker B: How do we do get around that, Kenny?
[00:06:58] Speaker A: We have Sundays that are not part of Lent.
[00:07:01] Speaker B: Yeah. So Sundays are not counted as Lent. And that makes sense because Sunday is.
[00:07:04] Speaker A: The day of feast of the resurrection of our Lord.
[00:07:06] Speaker B: Yeah. So why would we be fasting?
[00:07:09] Speaker A: Lenting?
[00:07:10] Speaker B: Lenting.
[00:07:11] Speaker A: You're supposed to be a little bit lenty, I think, still, aren't you?
[00:07:14] Speaker B: It's not a party.
[00:07:16] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:07:17] Speaker B: Whoa. Party soft. Dad's gone.
Let's go nuts. You do a week's worth of non fasting fasting and then you have to make up for it. So, yeah, if you're in the eastern church, they have about six and a half weeks. They call it the great Lent. They're a lot stricter with their fasting. They have a bit less fasting on Saturday, Sunday, but during the week it's really strictly vegan. Yeah, it is, isn't it? They're really strict. Animal products, dairy products, oils, I think.
[00:07:48] Speaker A: A lot of lentils.
[00:07:50] Speaker B: Saturday and Sunday, they still fast, but not as intently so they don't take the Sunday break. But then they stop the Sunday before Easter, I think it is. They stop. Or nine days before Easter it might be. So they actually like with us, we go right through all the way to Lent. Into Easter. Straight into Easter. They have a break.
[00:08:12] Speaker A: Interesting.
[00:08:13] Speaker B: It is interesting. Eh? How dare they? What's going. I want to know this. So maybe they need to stretch their stomachs to prepare for Easter. They've been veganing all that long. By the way, folks, if you want to find out more about Lent, don't forget that patrons only podcast.
Tuesday's episode was all about Lent and there's lots more interesting information about the origins, so we're not going to go into that. But Katie, basically, how would you describe lent if someone said to you, Katie, I've just fallen off a spaceship? What does Lent mean to you?
[00:08:44] Speaker A: It's a season of fasting, repentance and trying to redirect our hearts and minds to God.
[00:08:54] Speaker B: Wow, that's perfect.
[00:08:55] Speaker A: I told Bret and I have five bits of wisdom, so maybe that'll be one.
[00:08:59] Speaker B: That's number six. You're getting that for free, folks.
[00:09:01] Speaker A: You might not get the other four. I'll see how I feel.
[00:09:03] Speaker B: I thought you're going to say a general season of getting your act together.
[00:09:06] Speaker A: Yeah, that too.
[00:09:07] Speaker B: That's a great. That is perfect. That is a perfect summation. Right? Because I was struggling a little bit. How do you sum it up in one sentence? You've done it. Well done you.
I just wrote some bullet points. So aestheticism, so fasting and big word.
[00:09:24] Speaker A: For not doing stuff you like.
[00:09:25] Speaker B: Yeah. Mortifications. Like you might. People say, oh, I'm going to give it chocolate. Or a lot of people now say social media right?
[00:09:31] Speaker A: Yeah, coffee.
[00:09:32] Speaker B: Coffee. And then they do that, these moments of modification, fasting from meals or they might not normally do a lot of fasting, but during Lent they might commit to fast once a week, stuff like that.
Arms giving. So this is really important, like giving to the poor, doing works of charity.
[00:09:49] Speaker A: For the poor, giving away your actual arms. Lots of kids in primary school, it's.
[00:09:54] Speaker B: Spelled A-L-M. Folks, you need your arms before you go ripping those bad boys off. And I'm not that the poor would want your arms.
Thanks. There's a second hand shop down the road, but we're here all week.
[00:10:09] Speaker A: How many dad jokes have you got?
[00:10:11] Speaker B: I got plenty of dad jokes. I got plenty of dad jokes. In fact, could we do this? There we go.
[00:10:16] Speaker A: What's that noise?
[00:10:17] Speaker B: It was the rim shot, but I should have timed it for the joke. So, yeah, arms giving and giving to the poor and doing stuff. And then spiritual disciplines. So like, you might pray more, right?
[00:10:29] Speaker A: Yeah, you should try and pray more.
[00:10:30] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. Or you might say, I'm going to do a Lenten retreat. I'm going to go away for a weekend for some sort of prayerful retreat or something like that. You're generally that kind of focus. Right.
And so it is quite a beautiful time of drawing aside and I think quite countercultural in a culture of busyness especially.
[00:10:51] Speaker A: I think it's got harder in recent, like maybe the last decade, I think in the sense of like the supermarkets are full of hot cross buns and Easter eggs, like the day after Christmas. So you see them and you're like, well, you can't have them. Like, in our house, we don't eat Easter eggs until Easter.
[00:11:05] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:11:06] Speaker A: And I'm quite big on the hot cross buns. And not until Easter either. And I feel like the kids, poor kids, are like their kids friends are all bringing hot cross buns to school. And I'm like, why? You're not getting those until it's funny.
[00:11:16] Speaker B: That is such a sign of how countercultural we are now as christians and also how deficient our culture is. It's like, it's pure consumerism.
Yeah, I want an Easter egg. Literally, an Easter egg is nothing more than a sweet treat. And it's like, why can't we sell them to them on boxing Day? Then there's no meaning to it.
[00:11:36] Speaker A: That's right.
[00:11:37] Speaker B: The symbolism, the depth is all.
[00:11:39] Speaker A: Take the tradition and use it for.
[00:11:41] Speaker B: Yeah, purely for money making. It is so obscene. And I think even as a kid I remember there was not this rampant consumerism. So the hot cross buns would not appear until the tail. The weekend.
[00:11:56] Speaker A: Four, maybe eight.
[00:11:56] Speaker B: Yeah, because I remember there'd be sort of like a mad rush. Did you get the hot cross buns? And if you didn't, it'd be like, oh, they've run out. It was like that kind of a vibe.
[00:12:04] Speaker A: It was your own hot cross buns. My people, my people, my people, my people.
[00:12:08] Speaker B: Yeah, let's make hot cross buns. So Katie does, and she makes a mean hot cross bun. A mean. Did you hear about the baker, actually, who was baking hot cross buns? No, he died. He was electrocuted. He stood on a bun and the current ran up his leg.
[00:12:21] Speaker A: You're not allowed to put currants in our children.
[00:12:25] Speaker B: Yeah. And also there's a traditional recipe. Everything in the hot cross bun. We might talk about this in a future episode.
[00:12:30] Speaker A: Has a symbolism.
[00:12:31] Speaker B: Has a symbolism. We won't ruin it for you. We'll get to that.
Katie baking with Katie.
[00:12:38] Speaker A: Spiritual baking could be the most popular episode yet.
[00:12:41] Speaker B: What was that dodgy, progressive thing? Spirit cooking? We won't be doing any of that. Yeah, it sounds as bad as it sounds.
[00:12:47] Speaker A: We need a sound effect. Who matches my face?
[00:12:53] Speaker B: But basically it is an important time. It's quite countercultural. In a culture of hedonism and self gratification, you do the exact opposite. And you love God, love neighbor, and you make sacrifices. Man, that is. Wow. And you do it with your whole body. You ride in. So it makes it really special. How do you find it?
[00:13:14] Speaker A: Some days are easier than others.
[00:13:15] Speaker B: Yeah. Do you have, like, Lenten? Not dread, but like, oh, lent's coming.
[00:13:20] Speaker A: I'm always a little bit apprehensive, I think. Yeah. But I'm also always like. I think it's a good apprehension. Is that a word? Yeah, that's a word in the sense of like, you want to live it well because you don't want to get to east and be like, oh, I could have done that better. But I do message friends regularly through Lent saying, I am not very good at lenting today and things like that.
[00:13:39] Speaker B: It is hard a some days and you really feel some of those fasts you start out and you're like. Because you still got the memory of whatever chocolate you've just eaten. And you're like, yeah, I can do this. And then two days later you're like, what does chocolate taste? I'm dying.
Jesus, take me now.
It's so funny how human we are. Yeah. And how dopamine driven we are towards those little pleasures.
I don't know about you, but I sometimes find myself going, oh, gosh, getting to the tail end and going, oh, man, I've sort of slipped off the ball a bit. I wish I'd been a bit more focused. And this year I'm trying to be a bit more focused, but I try and say that every year, but every little bit matters.
Are you a consistent giver upper of things or do you try and change it up a bit?
[00:14:29] Speaker A: I think I was before I had children.
There was that year I gave up sugar in my coffee, and then I never went back. That was a great lent. Really, really good lent. Yeah. I quit one thing, but it wasn't sugar in everything. It was just like literally sugar and coffee. And then I tried to drink sugar and coffee, like, couldn't do Easter, and I was like, oh, this just tastes like sugar. So it was obviously a really good physical thing for me. But I do also remember it being a particularly good lent because that was quite hard for me and it was just one little thing. Right.
[00:14:58] Speaker B: Yeah.
It's interesting that the importance of that, as I said in the podcast episode today, one of the traps I see is people treating Lent now, even some christians. Yeah, it's like a holy diet. It's not a self improvement program.
It's nothing like that at all. Those good fruits, you get like, you got that amazing good fruit and benefit out of it. They're the fruits, they're not the focus. And so the focus is on preparation for Easter. It's on spiritual life. It's know mortification. Stripping back so Christ has more room.
[00:15:30] Speaker A: Yeah. I listened to a really good podcast last week from the abbots of St. Michael's Abbey in California recommend. It's called the Abbott circle on Spotify.
And they have actually really good little bite sized podcasts you can listen to. But this one was a bit longer. And one of the things they said that stuck with me was do an examination of conscience, beginning of Lent. Where am I now and where do I want to be at Easter in terms of your relationship with God? And what are the things you can strip away or what are things you need to strip away? Like habits you've built that are actually taking away from your relationship with God. So that really helped me because I think often we do think, oh, I need to do this. And this is a bad habit. That's a bad habit. But it's actually with the purpose in mind of where do I want to be in six weeks?
[00:16:13] Speaker B: Those clever little monks.
[00:16:14] Speaker A: Yeah, they are. That is quite cannons. Cannons I need to Google.
[00:16:19] Speaker B: They're the big gun.
[00:16:22] Speaker A: Cannon sound effect for me.
[00:16:27] Speaker B: But, yeah, that is great.
So they say do an examination at the beginning and a spiritual goal for you want to be.
[00:16:34] Speaker A: Yeah, because I think it's like anything else. Right. Like in a christian life, it's a bit woo. But we're on a journey. But we are on a journey. Lent is not like a one off part of the journey and it's to help us kind of. And it's great that it's the beginning of the year ish to kind of set you up for the year.
[00:16:58] Speaker B: And it's not a self help program, like I said before, but also it's not a self help program in the sense that it's not like, oh, I've bought this program that's going to improve this, this and this. It's much more messy and complicated because it's your relationship with God and it's more challenging.
[00:17:15] Speaker A: I see you've got a question there about being generous.
[00:17:17] Speaker B: Yeah, that was one of the ideas.
[00:17:18] Speaker A: I want to skip ahead to that.
[00:17:19] Speaker B: Yeah, of course. Can.
[00:17:20] Speaker A: I think sometimes people can over plan or over commit and maybe that sounds a little bit like I'm being a bit gentle, but in the sense of like, oh, I'm going to give up all sugar for the whole event. Well, that's a great idea, but like I said, by day two, you might be a little bit, if you're a sugar person, reverse diabetes. I've got a couple of things to say about that.
Don't go all guns blazing out of the gate. Take a day at a time and discern what is the Lord asking me to sacrifice today in this moment.
[00:17:49] Speaker B: That's good.
[00:17:50] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:17:50] Speaker B: And secondly, on that point, can you hold that thought? Because I've forgotten the other bit you said to me. I won't tell people what I'm going to be doing straight out of the gate, but I want to do something to sort of help me really set the tempo. Well, not the tempo, but the tone for Lent and really just really focus me. So I'm going to do something a bit bigger this year as we start.
And one of the things you said to me was, well, as long as that sacrifice doesn't negatively impact the family.
[00:18:17] Speaker A: Your sacrifice does not need to be someone else's sacrifice. You become a burden if you're making life harder for other people because of your sacrifice. Is that really what God's calling you to do or is that something you have decided? Yeah, this is obviously what God wants from me.
[00:18:31] Speaker B: Well, there's no point either.
You're not growing in sacrifice is actually making you unvirtuous. You're not loving your neighbor. The whole point is to love God more closely and intimately so you can love neighbor better.
[00:18:42] Speaker A: That's right. And sometimes it's harder to make that sacrifice in the moment, the sacrifice that's in front of you. It might be actually quite easy. You might find it by week two that, oh, I'm actually not doing so badly with giving up chocolate or sugar or alcohol, whatever food you might have chosen to fast from. But actually it's a sacrifice in the moment that's in front of you. Like my crying child who needs me now.
[00:19:05] Speaker B: So focus more intently on the everyday.
[00:19:07] Speaker A: Sacrifice that never got bathroom that needs to be cleaned. If you're someone that constantly gets stressed out by clutter, that's a personal example and you complain about it, well, maybe don't sacrifice the complaining and actually just do something with the clutter. Actually take 20 minutes out of your day to sort that out where you may not normally do that.
[00:19:26] Speaker B: So make a sacrifice of the ordinary everyday sufferings.
[00:19:29] Speaker A: It's something I've talked about before with quite a few of my friends, like the whole, especially as mums, I think mums have a lot of suffering already and a lot of putting themselves to the side. Well, we should if we're doing motherhood right. If you're sitting on the couch or something, bomb bonds, you might want to look at that. But I think in motherhood, if you're trying to do it right and live it well and love your children and your husband, then you put yourself to the side a lot. So you may not need to do that so much from a fasting point of view, but you may need to sacrifice by leaning in to the sufferings that are in your life and living those sufferings. Well, instead of going, oh, I have to cook dinner again, what about cooking everybody else's favorite dinners for the whole of lent and none of your own?
[00:20:12] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:20:12] Speaker A: And actually loving and sacrificing through that. Yeah.
[00:20:16] Speaker B: I was going to say when you said if you're sitting on the couch eating bomb bonds all day, how you do that, you might be a dad.
No, we're not that bad.
But yeah, that's good because I was going to talk about that point those cannons were talking about in that little video clip and I thought this was so beautiful for me. I'd never really heard anyone frame it like this. They talked about the idea of being generous with your fasting. So we tend to think of fasting as like, it's scrimping, it's saving, it's holding something back. But they were saying, no, be generous to God. That's what you're doing. And don't be afraid to be generous. And they were like, look, back in the day, it's only really recently that we were like, oh, no, don't let the children fast. Let's do it really simple and easy fast. They're like, no, don't be afraid to actually challenge yourself a bit. Don't go too extremes. Like you say, I'm going to give up all sugar. I'm not going to eat a single meal during lent, and I'll only drink twice. That's nuts. That's not what it is. But don't be afraid to actually be generous in your fasting. And I think the challenge, because the flip side of that, there's a tension because last year I saw someone online gave some really good advice about this, and they said, look, that in actual fact, sometimes it can be better to make one small sacrifice really, really well and consistently with dedication than to try and do three or four big ones and you're doing them badly.
[00:21:45] Speaker A: Don't keep piling stuff on.
[00:21:47] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:21:47] Speaker A: That doesn't mean that you're having a good lent necessarily.
[00:21:50] Speaker B: So when we say be generous, that will look differently for different people.
[00:21:53] Speaker A: Yeah, that's right. Absolutely.
[00:21:55] Speaker B: Like, I was thinking about fasting. For me, I already do regular fasting anyway, as part of my usual weekly schedule. And so I'm like, well, I shouldn't just turn one of those fast days into a lent. For me, that's not being generous. In fact, I'm not doing anything. So I would be very different in my fast day than what you would be because of where we're at. And the same with prayer, you would probably say, well, I'm going to do a different commitment because I'm at a different stage with my prayer than what Brendan or my friend Jill is or whoever it happens to be.
[00:22:30] Speaker A: Yeah, that's right.
[00:22:31] Speaker B: That's so, so essential. Last but not least. Well, two things, actually. But second to last but not least, individual and family commitments. We talked about it last night, didn't we?
[00:22:40] Speaker A: We did. We had a chat dinner with the kids. They came up with some interesting, possibly not very practical ideas.
I think it's good to have a family commitment, but you got to have buy in from everybody.
[00:22:52] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:22:53] Speaker A: And I think some people do some really cool things, like they have those lolly jars where you can put a lolly in every time you make a sacrifice or do something kind for someone else and then you get all the lollies at Easter.
[00:23:03] Speaker B: Yeah, we had friends who did that.
[00:23:04] Speaker A: I think it's quite cool because they can see, but I feel like some of our children would struggle with being able to see the lollies and not eat them.
[00:23:12] Speaker B: Yeah, we talked about doing the stations of the cross, praying the stations of the cross together every Friday.
We haven't done it well. Covid really sort of pulled the rug out from under us, but we haven't got back into it. We used to, we'd take the kids for a grocery shop at one point in Lent and then they would be part of it. And then we would donate those to the local St. Vincent de Paul and they would distribute them to people in need. And the children were part of it and they knew what was going on. It was our money was going to help other. So it's really about forming them. It's not about so much how much or little, but it's about them understanding. Oh, this is what you're supposed to do. Mum and dad do this, our family does this. And then when they leave home, please God, they'll keep doing that as well.
That's essential. And we also, with our kids, we talked about like last night, what are you giving up? We asked them.
It was interesting.
[00:24:07] Speaker A: Yeah, I think it's good to ask them. It's good to put it out there. But I don't think. I wouldn't ever force my children to tell me, like, I think sometimes a sacrifice is important if people want to keep it between themselves and.
[00:24:18] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly.
[00:24:19] Speaker A: Yeah, I think that's important.
[00:24:21] Speaker B: It's interesting because they ask, what are you giving up? I hit several times, same question, same children. What are you giving up for that? What are you giving up for that? They're trying to sort of sound us out, I think, and figure out, okay, what are they doing?
And then what that does is they want to then tell you rather than you need to be saying, well, what are you giving up? They're like, oh, well, here's what I'm giving up. So, yeah, it's a cool thing. I think it's a good thing to do. And I think it's also that sense of the communal nature, of the generosity of sacrificing. And you're in it together. It's not just like mum is an individual, dad's an individual, Lucy's an individual. And no one knows really, what. You can't encourage each other. You can't keep each other motivated to keep going and stuff if you're on your own.
[00:25:02] Speaker A: I think it's important to remember as well, a lot of us will do food related sacrifices. We may not do the same thing all of lent, but you probably do something. It's an easy thing to say, oh, I don't have to have this treat.
[00:25:13] Speaker B: Right?
[00:25:13] Speaker A: Yeah, we're not easy always.
But I think it's important to remember that if you do eat something that's on your forbidden Lenten list, the forbidden fruit, the Lord doesn't go, oh, well, that's that then.
Actually thank him for that and move on.
It was like abstain for five minutes and then next summer the same for ten minutes and then some of the same for 20 minutes. And then eventually you can sort of build up to it's okay to appreciate a gift and something nice for what it is. And even a lent.
[00:25:47] Speaker B: Yeah, because it's not an obsessive passion on denial, it's making room for God. It's about putting self seeking, it's about being reminded of the sacrifice of the cross.
[00:26:00] Speaker A: That's right.
[00:26:01] Speaker B: And yeah, it shouldn't be this weird, scrupulous flexation on, well, I said no chocolates. And they brought out a chocolate today at the going away party at the staff meeting. And so a lady gave me one to me and I threw it in her face and said, get away from me.
[00:26:16] Speaker A: Get behind me, Satan.
[00:26:17] Speaker B: Get behind me with your bon bearings, your sweet, tasty bon bonds. That is so funny. An angel of light.
Yeah, that's a really good point, especially for kids.
[00:26:31] Speaker A: Right? Like we're encouraging them to give things up, but we also don't slam them if they.
[00:26:35] Speaker B: No, well, the reality is you are going to have moments. We all do. That's the struggle too. Right. And funnily enough, I think it's the meeting. God in those moments is in some ways, in certain sense, that there's probably something healthier, maybe, or it could stand to be corrected on this. But about someone who says, well, I'm going to give up a thing. I'm not going to have coke for the whole of Lent. And then they have a Coke one day and they go, oh, gosh, I shouldn't have done that. Right back into it again, as opposed to someone who goes, I'm going to give up coke. And they just forget about it. And then it's like, oh, it's Easter time. And there was no thought, there was no intentionality. I think that does matter.
[00:27:11] Speaker A: It's not the fall that matters. But the fight, right? Getting back up after the fall and keeping on going, that's actually what matters to God. How many times in our christian life outside of Lent do we not that.
[00:27:20] Speaker B: Having a coke during lent is a sin or anything like that? It's not, we're saying, but you're right. It's the engagement, the intentionality.
And this is where, what you're saying before, this is where you think about, well, what does sacrifice mean to me? It might be very different and at a much lower level to someone else.
[00:27:37] Speaker A: And if you can't give up caffeine without becoming to live with, don't do that.
There's something else the Lord is calling you to do. Let me tell you.
[00:27:47] Speaker B: Love your neighbor. Yeah. Like, seriously, that's the danger right now.
[00:27:50] Speaker A: Your family first, right.
[00:27:51] Speaker B: People are like, well, yeah, I'm going to get on a holy diet, my self improvement program. And then it's like, well, if you want to do one of those, do one of those at another time when the rest of your family is not also sacrificing and has to put up with it.
I'd say, too, particularly to the men who are listening, I know things like Exodus 90 have been kind of popular with men lately. Great. If that's helpful for you. One bit of advice I give to men is don't. It's like yoyo dieting. Don't be someone who goes in and out of that program constantly. I think that's, to me, that's more like a one off, and that should be the boot camp. That then leads to something consistent.
[00:28:28] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:28:29] Speaker B: And so I would also say I'm kind of cautious about doing it at lent because it's 90 days, not 40.
[00:28:35] Speaker A: That's right. January the first this year.
[00:28:38] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:28:38] Speaker A: Which is right in the middle of the Christmas season.
[00:28:40] Speaker B: Yeah. So I'd say be careful with that because our liturgical calendar does matter, so be careful around that. It really does matter. And you shouldn't be creating these sort of countersigns in your life. I don't think it's a great program and it's helpful, but I think you shouldn't Yoyo in and out of it all the time. And also, don't. I know one thing I've heard from some mothers and wives is, look, I really love the fact my husband is doing something, making effort, but this program is really hard on us as a family because there's this special diet, there's this cold showers. There's husband who's up and away and not home anymore. All those kinds of things.
[00:29:14] Speaker A: Like the whole 30 of Catholicism, isn't it? Remember that big fad for whole 30, like five years ago?
Only whole foods for 30 days. That's right. Just with cold showers and press shoot.
[00:29:24] Speaker B: Me in the foot.
Yeah.
So do be cautious about that. And one last thing is, there's a bit of a trap that I've seen lately, the last couple of years where some christians are like, yeah, I'm going to fast from punching people in the face. That's my fast.
[00:29:42] Speaker A: Oh, that thing that goes around Facebook every year? Instead of fasting, be kind.
[00:29:46] Speaker B: And you should be doing all those things anyway. No Christian should be fasting from a thing they shouldn't be doing. You just shouldn't be doing it. There's no fast. So fast is from things that are goods that you would normally be entitled to, but you'd make that extra sacrifice. So there's no sacrifice in giving up violent armed robberies, because you shouldn't be doing those kinds of things. But also, Lent is like, you should add in extra things. I'm going to be kind to my neighbor, but there should also be aestheticism. Yes, you need that sacrifice component. Without sacrifice, there is no true worship, there is no true religion. And so you do need to think.
[00:30:19] Speaker A: About what that means because it unites us to Christ, right?
[00:30:22] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. So, yeah, Lent.
[00:30:25] Speaker A: Well, we've told you what to do. Off you go, get to it.
[00:30:29] Speaker B: One last little plug of the podcast, too, folks. If you want to hear a whole lot more of the history of Lent, like this morning's episode, we're recording it on Tuesday. But yesterday's episode called do you even Lent, bro?
It's all about the history, about theological background to it. And if you want more of that, you can check out a little ten minute preview for free. But $5, patron, you get access to that.
Okay, so, Katie, we should really talk about our moment of goodness, truth or beauty. We had this planned today. We're going to go through the usual stuff and we're going to answer some questions. But what we might actually do is we'll do our moment of good and truth or beauty, see how the time's tracking, and maybe a conversation about lenders. Enough. Or maybe we might tackle one question, right. That musical interlude, folks, you know what that means if you're a regular listener. But let's jump into then, our moment of goodness, truth or beauty.
[00:31:34] Speaker A: Katie, yours is very literary.
[00:31:37] Speaker B: It is a literal literary moment.
[00:31:41] Speaker A: Mine is literary a little bit, too. You're doing more good.
[00:31:43] Speaker B: Well, I did because that was a dad joke, kind of. So what's yours? Ladies first.
[00:31:49] Speaker A: Mine is about books, kind of.
[00:31:51] Speaker B: Oh, we're both on the literary train today.
[00:31:53] Speaker A: But it's not about a book. It's about when I went to netball the other night and Elena was.
[00:31:58] Speaker B: Hold on, that's not a book, that's sports.
[00:32:00] Speaker A: Eleanor was having a complete meltdown about having had to eat her revolting dinner of potatoes. Chicken.
[00:32:06] Speaker B: That was hilarious. A beautiful dinner, by the way, folks. It was yummy.
[00:32:09] Speaker A: Lasted an hour, this meltdown. Not the dinner.
[00:32:12] Speaker B: We could have cooked a dinner on the meltdown.
[00:32:14] Speaker A: It was intense. We were both trying to be very calm, very calm, very christian. And in the end, as I walked out the door, she was eating her potatoes. So I feel like we won a little bit.
[00:32:23] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:32:23] Speaker A: Anyway, the point is, I came back home, I didn't know what I was going to walk into. You were working, I think, or had gone out, maybe?
[00:32:30] Speaker B: No.
[00:32:31] Speaker A: Oh, you had loose.
[00:32:33] Speaker B: We're at that stage now, faith driving.
[00:32:35] Speaker A: We've got all these. We've got three babysitters. It's awesome. And I thought, I don't know what I'm going to walk back into because she might have had half loaf of.
[00:32:43] Speaker B: Bread, broken plate, smashed against the wall.
[00:32:45] Speaker A: She was pretty worked up and she also did not want me to leave, so that's part of the problem. And I came back in and Maddie, one of our twins, was sitting on the couch and she had read about six comic books to Eleanor and was telling her jokes and making her laugh. Yeah, she just turned the whole situation around. It's so awesome that you can just leave.
[00:33:04] Speaker B: She's got a real gift.
[00:33:05] Speaker A: She does. Yeah. It's beautiful.
[00:33:07] Speaker B: So that was your moment, was it? You're seeing. Coming in and seeing that. So you got two for one that you didn't come home to hellish carnage.
[00:33:14] Speaker A: Yeah, I was worried.
[00:33:15] Speaker B: And you came under that beautiful sight instead.
[00:33:17] Speaker A: Yeah, it was awesome.
[00:33:18] Speaker B: Lucky you. Very special. That's a good moment. Mine is. You're right, is literary, something I posted on social media the other day. But it was just. It really struck me just how beautiful it was. It's only a couple of days ago, too. The anniversary of this. February the 9th, 1881. So going back a while, russian novelist Fyodor Dostoesky passed away at home with his family gathered around him. And the thing that was so beautiful was his final act. What he did was he called his children in in his dying moments and he asked his wife to read the account of the prodigal son from the gospel of Luke out loud, while he held their hands and his daughter recounted the whole scene. And as he's dying, he then tells his children, look, my children, and I'll quote from him here, never forget what you have just heard. Have absolute faith in God and never despair of his pardon. I love you dearly, but my love is nothing compared with the love of God for those he has created. Even if you should be so unhappy as to commit a crime, never despair of God. You are his children. Humble yourselves before him as before your father. Implore his pardon and he will rejoice over your repentance as the father rejoiced over that of the prodigal son. That way. What a beautiful. What a gift. What a way to go, man. I pray and hope that I have that kind of courage and mental acuity to. What is it? Back then, they seem to know how to go out on a bang. It was class. Yeah. Bring me vodka. I tell you story, children, but yeah. And it's just such a beautiful mean. It's just profound is what it is. And it's also. That's the central theme of a lot of his writings, was about repentance, forgiveness, redemption, the love of God, and that no one is beyond salvation. It's quite a beautiful thing. Right?
So your scripture of the month, Katie, do you have a scripture reflection for us?
Oh, she's looking for.
[00:35:18] Speaker A: Oh, it's from my favorite psalm.
[00:35:19] Speaker B: Can I say, is it una memomento? Is that correct or am I just making that up when you said a moment, please? Una momento.
[00:35:26] Speaker A: Momento.
[00:35:27] Speaker B: Yeah. So it's close.
[00:35:28] Speaker A: Too many o's.
[00:35:31] Speaker B: I will stop with the foreign languages right now.
[00:35:33] Speaker A: Mine is very short, which is probably good, because I can say yours and it's long.
[00:35:39] Speaker B: I feel attacked.
[00:35:42] Speaker A: So it's from my favorite psalm, which is psalm 51, but it's not my favorite verse.
[00:35:46] Speaker B: Is that your favorite psalm? Yeah, it's my favorite psalm.
[00:35:50] Speaker A: Romantic.
[00:35:52] Speaker B: I didn't know it was your favorite, honestly. It is just absolutely everyone.
Psalm 23. The Lord is my shepherd. It's because probably the only one love you on it. For me, it's like, no repentance and mercy. It's so beautiful. Anyway, I didn't realize it was yours.
[00:36:06] Speaker A: So usually I go for the bit about the contrite heart, but I was reading it in morning prayer the other day, and the bit that stuck out was indeed. You love truth in the heart. Then in the secret of my heart, teach me wisdom.
[00:36:21] Speaker B: Wow. Read that again.
[00:36:22] Speaker A: So beautiful. Indeed. You love truth in the heart. Then in the secret of my heart, teach me wisdom.
[00:36:28] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:36:29] Speaker A: I thought so beautiful. How to think about how that really is. Where God teaches us in the secret of our heart.
I'm sure you've heard lots of wisdom here this morning, but when we really want to come close to God and hear what he has to say, it's in the secret of our heart that he does it more often than not. It's not big signs. Wow, big splashy things. It's that quiet place.
[00:36:53] Speaker B: That's the spiritual life, the interior life. Right? Because we are taught, or maybe we just imbibe it from a culture of constant noise. We're like, well, God will give me.
[00:37:03] Speaker A: A sign if I scroll facebook. Eventually something meaningful will pop up and tada. I will know what God wants me to do with my life.
[00:37:10] Speaker B: Yeah, that whole notion of grace builds on nature. And so we've got to do our bit. And then God will say to you, hey, yeah, you're walking in the wrong direction.
Change tempo or change direction, but you've got to be walking.
[00:37:22] Speaker A: That's right.
[00:37:23] Speaker B: And we're often waiting on the Couch going, well, tell me when I should walk. And he's like, get walking, and I'll tell you where to go.
[00:37:29] Speaker A: And it makes me think, like, because secrets are like quiet things. You have to be still and quiet and beautiful, close to God. And to hear that wisdom and to learn that wisdom.
[00:37:41] Speaker B: I can hear a worship song in there.
[00:37:42] Speaker A: Go on.
[00:37:43] Speaker B: In the secret of my heart. That's just a made up one. But you can imagine that being, because I know there are some who've been written specifically with that in mind. And the thing, too, about, as you're saying about a secret, it sort of dawned on me, is the intimacy and the profound oneness and total knowledge that God has of you.
[00:38:03] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:38:03] Speaker B: It's not like he gets out on the clouds and says, here is a message for Katie Malone.
[00:38:09] Speaker A: Everyone reads it like a modern learning environment over a big microphone. Katie?
[00:38:13] Speaker B: Katie. Paging Katie Malone. Stop that right now. Get back on track.
Yeah. Paging Brendan Malone. You're okay. Keep doing what you're doing. Imagine that'd be awful, wouldn't it? But that's the challenge, too. This is the great. Because I've been reading over the holiday break anyway, reading a bit more of Cormac McCarthy's work, his novels. And I love Cormac McCarthy, but he is a bit darker. And his big thing is Hemingway, but he's also his big thing. And the more of his novels you read, the more you realize he keeps coming back to this theme, the silence of God, and he struggles with it. Where is God in the midst of the suffering and the silence? Whereas the counter to that is that the christian spiritual life is like, well, that's where we engage with God.
Elijah right on the mountain, looking for the fire and the thunder and everything else, but God was in the still, small voice. He's not in all that big.
It's a. It's a beautiful sort of paradox, eh? The silence of God, which is supposedly the people try and claim it's a proof he doesn't exist, is actually for us as christians, that's the place, the very place where we meet God. And that is so profound. And by the way, God isn't really silent. If he was silent in our world, truly we would live in a diabolical, evil world with so much brutality and barbarism and horrific evil. Worse than a concentration camp. No hope of redemption, just pure demonic people who had no ability to even find redemption, which you still had even with concentration camp guards, believe it or not, I know, as hard as that is, and that's what a world without God would look like. So the silence is not proof of God's absence at all.
[00:39:57] Speaker A: That's all right.
[00:39:57] Speaker B: The fact that we actually live in a world where people can find redemption is proof that God is at work and we just don't realize it half the time. Very true. Wow, that's a beautiful passage, Katie. Mine was Mark, chapter one, verse 40 to 45, and I'll read it to you. A leper came to Jesus and pleaded on his knees, if you want to, he said, you can cure me. Feeling sorry for him, Jesus stretched out his hand and touched him. Of course I want to, he said, be cured. And the leprosy left them at once and he was cured. Jesus immediately sent him away and sternly ordered him, mind you, say nothing to anyone, but go and show yourself to the priest and make the offering for your healing prescribed by Moses as evidence of your recovery. The man went away, but then started talking about it freely and telling the story everywhere so that Jesus could no longer go openly into any town but had to stay outside in places where nobody lived. Even so, people from all around would come to him. So there's so much in that. Even think about the demand and the busyness of ministry. And here's Jesus, the very son of God, who's having to draw aside. So there's a lesson in that for all of us, anyone who's involved in ministry or parenting or anything like that, even Jesus had to stop. Pause. But the things that really struck out to or stuck out to me about this was, number one, was the compassion of Christ. He says, of course I want to. It's not like, question, yeah, it's not, okay, I'll do it. Or, okay, if you jump through three hoops or stand in that line over there, take a number, then I'll do it. It's like, of course I want to. It's like there's no question of him wanting to heal. And of course, leprosy is what it is, a type of. For us today, we would say leprosy is a sign of spiritual sickness and privation and illness. For us today, that's the comparison. And so when we come to Christ with our sins, our brokenness, whatever it is, our spiritual deficiencies, and Christ says, of course I want to heal you. I want to heal you. So that's, number one is the compassion of Christ. It's amazing. Secondly is the instruction to be faithful to the law of Moses.
And sometimes you get people who make this little mistake, and they're like, yeah, Jesus wasn't into religion. He's not into laws of man. And it's like, yeah, because they're not laws of man. That's why he tells them to go and do this. And so don't make that mistake. Know, Jesus doesn't do religion because here he is proving you wrong at this point, at this juncture. And that's a challenge for all of us. So the problem is not with religious observance. The problem is with hypocritical, vacuous, empty, self aggrandizing. Yeah.
[00:42:35] Speaker A: Wearing ecclesiastes.
[00:42:36] Speaker B: Long and. Yeah. So people go, oh, that's a very. Katie's very religious. I see her in the street praying out loud, thank goodness I'm not like those other heathens. She says she must be holy. Yeah. So that's the kind of thing. And the Pharisees, their problem is hypocrisy. And they have no integrity. They don't practice what they preach. So it's actually not the observance of the law and religious tradition and stuff like that. It's the disposition of heart. Of the heart, the lack of virtue, the lack of love. But the really interesting thing for me is I went to my scriptural commentary on the Gospel of Mark, and I had a look at this passage, and the word be, when he says, be healed or be cured, it's the same word that we read in the book of Genesis when God is creating the world when he's bringing everything into being.
And that's quite a profound thing.
[00:43:28] Speaker A: You're like, he's not just healing him, he's making.
[00:43:31] Speaker B: No, he's making a new man. This is a new creation and that is his ministry. And you're like, wow. And it's also the power of who he is. The God who created the universe is now walking amongst us, healing a leper. And it's a recreation, total recreation. It's. Man, that's profound.
So, yeah, that was my scriptural reflection. I don't know if I quite got the beautiful intimacy of yours, but, yes, I talked about Jesus.
[00:44:01] Speaker A: You looked at your genesis and all that.
[00:44:04] Speaker B: You went and looked at the commentary, folks. So that was our moment of goodness, truth and beauty and our little scriptural reflections for the month. Katie, should we look at one question? Yeah, let's do this. There's one question that's really pressing amongst the three and we'll save the other two for next episode. The question is this, how do we get back into a good, stable routine after the holidays? Now, this could be a person, an individual who's maybe looking to get their routine back. It could be a family, could be a ministry, could be a workplace, anything where you stop. And I don't know about you, but every year I'm like, I go to the tail end of the year and I'm like. And particularly last year, I was like, man, I've got these great habits in place and I'm going to stop for a break and then I'm going to come back. Boom. Straight back in. But every year, it is a bit of a struggle. There's no boom. It's like stumble, flop, fall on my face, get up two weeks later. So, yeah. Do you find that challenge.
[00:45:13] Speaker A: This year?
[00:45:14] Speaker B: Do you never get arrest? Now, you worked too hard this year. You overworked. Can I tell you off in front of our listeners, you did overwork.
[00:45:20] Speaker A: Humiliate me in front of.
[00:45:22] Speaker B: No, hold on. No, that's not a joke. There was again, that was the rim shot. Well, we need this one. Come on, man. So what I mean by that is that you had such a busy load on your plate, your church stuff, the hearts of flame, catholic summer school. You were co leader. You're giving yourself massively. You got sick and run down and it was just pretty.
[00:45:49] Speaker A: Yeah. And then straight back to work when I got home.
[00:45:51] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:45:53] Speaker A: So how do we get back into a good, stable routine? Hopefully you've had one to start with, because it will be a lot easier if you're not. Great point, scratch.
[00:46:01] Speaker B: So, number one, if you don't know what a routine looks like, you haven't.
[00:46:04] Speaker A: Got a hope of getting back into one now.
[00:46:06] Speaker B: Yeah. You need to know what routine.
[00:46:08] Speaker A: If you're a mum and you're listening, I recommend the book a mother's rule of life.
[00:46:11] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:46:12] Speaker A: Which I will put my hand up and say, yes, I've read it, but I haven't. She implemented everything. She's a homeschooling mum. It was written quite a few years ago now. But I do know some people out there in radio land, what do you call this? Podcast.
[00:46:23] Speaker B: Podcast land.
[00:46:24] Speaker A: That have read it and they love it. Implemented. Yeah, she's great. Holly Perlo is her name. She's awesome.
[00:46:30] Speaker B: So what's it called again?
[00:46:31] Speaker A: A mother's rule of mother's life. So she essentially took like the rule of a religious order, like a benedictine.
[00:46:37] Speaker B: Monk or something like that, but not.
[00:46:39] Speaker A: As strict, because we're not benedictine monks, we're mums, and we have baby people to look after.
[00:46:44] Speaker B: And those monks didn't have children who.
[00:46:46] Speaker A: Are not interested in a rule of life. Please and thank you very much.
Children's stable routine is basically breakfast snack, lunch snack, dinner snack.
[00:46:55] Speaker B: But you know what I was thinking about? The Benedictines probably imitated parenthood because they would get up in the middle of the night to pray.
[00:47:01] Speaker A: That is true.
[00:47:02] Speaker B: So that's like getting up for your kids.
[00:47:03] Speaker A: There's actually an order somewhere who is an order of women, like nuns, who get up when they do the earliest one, which is mattens or whatever.
[00:47:13] Speaker B: I think it is middle of the night.
[00:47:14] Speaker A: And they offer that for all mothers around the world, up with children.
[00:47:18] Speaker B: So they pray for.
[00:47:19] Speaker A: How cool is that? Man, when I heard that, I was like, oh, that's awesome. Like, how many mums out there who just feel so alone in the night? There are a group of women praying for you somewhere in the world at.
[00:47:28] Speaker B: 04:00 a.m. And there a lot of parallels, though. I like what she's done there because like I said, so obviously they would get up in the middle of the night to pray. Like, as parents, you're often woken in the middle of night by kids. And also, the other big thing of religious life is you actually die to self in a very big way. So particularly for the Benedictines, they actually wouldn't even lay claim to their own work. There's a lot of humility. And some of their orders, they would actually be buried in unmarked gray. So there'd be a cross, but no name. So that use total humility. You belong to God. And really, as parents, we talk about culture. Yeah. We pour out. Well, exactly. Right. And total oblation. Pour yourself out for your children.
[00:48:05] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:48:08] Speaker B: So number one is you got to know what a routine is. If you don't know what a routine.
[00:48:11] Speaker A: Is, you're not going to go back crazy about it. Just find one that works for your family. Right?
[00:48:16] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:48:16] Speaker A: So what works for me and what I would recommend is that you set an alarm, and when the alarm goes off, you get up.
[00:48:22] Speaker B: Just get out.
[00:48:22] Speaker A: And even if that becomes your lenten sacrifice, because you've never done it before, getting up when your alarm goes off for the whole of lent. Awesome. If that's something you don't do, can.
[00:48:30] Speaker B: I say, that point is so key in goal setting. They talk about the importance of small changes and manageable goals. So what tends to happen is, like, the big goal, the Mount Everest summit moment, is I want to be a better mum. I want to be more organized. Right. That's the big goal. But if you obsess on that and not the small stuff in front of you, you'll never get there. So what you've got to do is you've got to say, my goal is to get out of bed. That's my obsession. Get out of bed as soon as the alarm goes. And if you do that, then you are on the way to Everest, the top of Everest, becoming that mum.
[00:49:02] Speaker A: Absolutely. Yeah. So, yeah, getting up when your alarm goes off, setting an alarm, then getting up when it going off. And starting your day.
[00:49:10] Speaker B: Right.
[00:49:10] Speaker A: Obviously, if you can start the day with some prayer. I just noticed this in my own life, and I'm not talking, like, half an hour. Like, I'm tired in the morning. I'm not good at praying in the morning. But if I can do a five minute morning offering, read the readings for the day or read some psalms or whatever, open my bible.
[00:49:27] Speaker B: That's good.
[00:49:27] Speaker A: IPad Bible.
Yeah. It just sets you up right. For the day, I think.
[00:49:33] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:49:33] Speaker A: I'm not saying you won't have any trouble. I'm not saying breakfast time won't be hard. Getting kids out the door won't be hard. Or starting school for the day won't be hard. No.
[00:49:40] Speaker B: Still challenges.
[00:49:40] Speaker A: Yeah. But you start, right?
[00:49:42] Speaker B: And you start with God, I think I find. Yeah, I absolutely agree. What I've discovered, actually, lately is this is where prayer of the church is really helpful. And a lot of denominations pray, what we call the office of the church. And particularly, like, if you're an Anglican, you'll know exactly what I'm talking about. They're often a lot more focused on it.
[00:50:00] Speaker A: They sing, even song, a beautiful. Yeah.
[00:50:02] Speaker B: So they call it Lord's first thing in the morning. That's morning prayer. And I found what it is, is there's several psalms that you recite, some couple of responses and a couple of prayers. It's beautiful. And there's an app called Universalis, which is free. You can download. It's got the prayer of the church on it. Even if you're not a Catholic, don't feel that you have to look at all the other secret business in there. But you might find some stuff.
But the universalis has the prayer of the church all the different times. And lords is the morning prayer, and it's great. And what that means is you don't have to take it out of airplane mode. You sit there. And I found, for me, that has really been helpful, because those psalms and the little two lines of the scripture reading each day, they are deliberately designed with the intent of this is a person praying in the morning, dedicating themselves to God. And so what happens is, I found that. That actually, I don't have to sit there and go, I've got to create something, and I've got to speak to God with these unique words that I've made up. Otherwise I'm failing. No, I pray the prayers that already, the psalms. And what happens is I've found that more fruitful and I don't have to.
[00:51:10] Speaker A: I think, creates an openness.
[00:51:11] Speaker B: Yeah. And I'm not struggling to feel, oh, I'm not doing it right. The routine helps of that. Doing that.
[00:51:17] Speaker A: Absolutely. And I think I would also encourage you. I know some people struggle, will think their children will struggle with a routine, but you hear this all the time in parenting. But children thrive off routine. And it's true, though. Like, I look at my kids in the holidays, and they're like, what are we doing today? Every day, what are we doing today? What are we doing today? And it's because they don't know what school teachers carnage. They know what we're doing. Right? So I think it's really good for them. And even if you have to write it down so they can see it, this is our morning routine. This is what we do after school.
This is what we do after dinner. And they know the things. They know, okay, I'm allowed half an hour on a tablet, or I'm allowed. This is when we read a book or we go for a bike ride.
[00:51:58] Speaker B: Or start getting them to take responsibility, too for the parts of the world and their life that they can. Not enough parents do that today. We used to be just left to it. Remember that?
[00:52:09] Speaker A: We out riding my bike tour at dinner time.
[00:52:11] Speaker B: Don't helicopter your kids. Yeah, writing it down is good. So I've got a schedule, my new schedule I've written for this year. It's just the weekday schedule.
[00:52:18] Speaker A: Given it to his wife.
[00:52:20] Speaker B: It's my secret schedule.
[00:52:21] Speaker A: Told off for that?
[00:52:21] Speaker B: Yeah, I did get told off last night for this, actually. We won't go into that here in front of the guests, though, will we? No.
And I think what the key is, you've got to be flexible and realistic. So this schedule looks different to what it did last week. So last week and I had this big plan how I was going to start, and it was very apparent to me after starting it, I've jammed myself up early on in the day. So what I need to do is reshuffle, change this thing, give myself more time here and now this week with the new schedule. Yeah, it's working now. It's not like I'm on holiday camp. I've still got a thing to thing to thing. But hands up, if you remember that, if you remember that, you get a prize. Tell us what that show was called.
Spoiler alert. She's already told you.
But, yeah, being flexible. I think I made a mistake for a long time of going. No, I must conform myself to this program. And often I would be adopting other people's routines. And it's like, that's their routine.
I've mentored people and I've said to them, like, with prayer, if you struggle to pray, well, first thing in the morning, then maybe don't start your day with your focused prayer. So start it with a prayer. Jump out of bed. Just say, lord, I surrender this day to you. Thank you for bringing me safety through another night. Pray the our father and then do what you're going to do and then come back later in the day. And maybe you have 15 minutes, 20 minutes, half an hour, an hour, however long you take, that focused prayer is when you're actually awake and capable of doing it well. Don't give God the second hand dregs and go, oh, I did my prayers, but someone else morning is the perfect time for them. So recognize the uniqueness of your situation and you as a person. But you've got to have a routine, right?
[00:54:14] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, I mean, you don't have to, but your life will be better with one.
[00:54:18] Speaker B: Well, you'll get dragged through the day without it.
[00:54:20] Speaker A: Yeah, I think we flourish as humans when we have. Yes, we have a routine.
[00:54:23] Speaker B: A great metaphor, again, is exercise. You're not going to get fitter or stronger if you don't do anything regularly. So you've got to have that regular routine. And what I found, interestingly enough, is you think a routine ties me down. I'm a free spirit, Katie. I don't want no routine. I don't want the man bogging me down. You're actually not that free without a routine. And I found that when you have the routine, I'm more creative and these spaces open up that I didn't realize I had before because that actually gives you a jumping off point.
But, yeah, I think if you've had a complete mirror of a holiday, I think that's one of my challenges, is that I was saying this to someone the other day and I don't know whether part of it's, I'm a male. It's also a struggle I have. I feel gender stereotype. Well, I just assumed my own gender. What the heck, what a bigot I am.
But, yeah, one of my struggles is I sort of feel like I'm a bit worthless, particularly to ministry and to my donors and people like that if I'm not doing stuff. It's this sense of this false utilitarianism and like, I've got to be proving my worth. And so I often come out of the holidays and this one was, I'll just be honest with you folks, this one was a bit of a struggle for me. I came out and I'm thinking, oh, I just felt a bit down about stuff because I was like, I feel useless. I haven't been doing stuff and am I really contributing? And what happens on the back of that, as I get into you fall down a spiral where you start to think, oh, maybe I'm not doing anything worthwhile. That comes on the back of that.
[00:55:55] Speaker A: Woman who are mothers, woman, maybe woman in general, don't have time to think.
[00:55:59] Speaker B: No, there is a goodness in that. And there's a lesson for us. Get your routine sorted and what will happen is, I guarantee you, the first week or two, if that's the challenge you're having, like a depression or a depressive state, not necessarily hard core depression, guarantee you that you're going to go, oh, I still feel bad this isn't working, whatever. After about week two, week three, you'll start to notice, no, something's shifting here, you might not even notice it. You'll look back and realize it's changed by looking back. So stick with it.
I think it's just so essential. And plan it out. Don't be a planning nerd, but don't be afraid to actually.
[00:56:39] Speaker A: You don't have to have a spreadsheet like Brendan does.
[00:56:41] Speaker B: No. Well, and it's pretty basic. It doesn't have every second every day, but it's the key elements of it. And I found that's been really helpful.
But, yeah, I'd say the other thing, too, is be aware of what bad habits might have held you back or pulled you out of your routine, or even people who are like, no, don't need to pray, mate. Come and go for a surf with me at 06:00 a.m. Or whatever. Figure out, okay, I got to address this. If my prayer life has collapsed and it's a person, I've got to talk to this person. And hopefully you won't have to be as drastic as saying, look, man, I got to cut you out. Stop hanging out. Yeah, shun Amish shunning, but just say, look, man, my prayer is important. And I feel, unfortunately, this is a bit of a distraction. Can we figure out another way to do this? If the person says, nah, well, you're not my surf buddy anymore, then were they really that much of a friend anyway? Because they didn't seek your good, they didn't really love you. But maybe it's bad habits. You started staying up late at night to watch your british tv shows.
[00:57:37] Speaker A: Oi, who are you talking about?
[00:57:38] Speaker B: Well, I was thinking about myself, the.
[00:57:40] Speaker A: British tv shows that I recommend.
[00:57:42] Speaker B: I know that you dust love a good british tv show, but, yeah, think about those often. We think, oh, I'll get back into it. I'll get my routine going, and then we've got these bad habits still. You got to deal with them, too.
[00:57:53] Speaker A: That's what Lent's good for, guys. Yeah, I need the hold on full circle.
[00:57:57] Speaker B: There it is.
All right, so, yeah, I think that's. We've answered that question, haven't we? So hopefully that's helpful, folks. Gosh, it's been great to be back with you again. It's good to be back into it for the year. We will talk about hot cross buns.
[00:58:10] Speaker A: Do you promise?
[00:58:11] Speaker B: I promise you. We might talk about hot cross buns. Maybe stations of the cross, too, for those who don't know about them, because we'll still be in lent at that.
[00:58:18] Speaker A: Stage, name dropping all our catholic things into the podcast.
[00:58:21] Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, not just Catholics. Stations of the cross. A lot of denominations do those. They're really beautiful, eh? But yeah, we're on the Abbott circle podcast. Is it? That'll be why the Anglicans love it.
[00:58:33] Speaker A: We have to get them to cross promote our podcast.
[00:58:35] Speaker B: Maybe we should interview them. They'll probably give us really hard advice.
[00:58:39] Speaker A: You guys are scary, you cannons.
[00:58:41] Speaker B: You're not praying for 5 hours a day, are you?
Anyway, so in the meantime, look, if you want to support our ministry work, you can do
[email protected]. Nz or patreon.com left footmedia and you will get our free daily podcast. That's me. Engaging with and giving commentary on culture, current affairs, religious issues.
Our listeners seem to enjoy it. Hopefully you'll find it enjoyable as well. Don't forget to send us your questions. The littleflockpodcast.org or lifenet.org nz. Please don't forget about the forge. We've taken a bit of a leap of faith this year. We've got someone who's joining us part time to do video editing and design stuff, which is going to really help things. We want to reach people. We really want to reach more people.
And there's a bit of a risk of the challenge. It needs funding and support to keep that going. So if you're in a position to support, look, we'd really appreciate your financial partnership. Lifenet.org nz the donate page has got all the details. Katie, do you want to say anything else before we wrap this bad boy up?
[00:59:42] Speaker A: No. It's been great to be back.
[00:59:44] Speaker B: It is good, isn't it? Have a good. A holy gonna. I was gonna say don't say happy lent. I say merry Lent. A holy.
[00:59:52] Speaker A: Don't forget to put the lent in Valentine's Day.
[00:59:56] Speaker B: What are you doing on Valentine's Day? Getting ashes on my head and being told I'm dust.
[01:00:01] Speaker A: Adding one. What is it? One big meal, two small meals.
[01:00:04] Speaker B: Yeah, I'll be fasting. We fast from Valentine's anyway. We don't do. We're not Valentine's. Some people love it. If you love it, that's fine. We're not going to judge you, but we're kind of.
[01:00:14] Speaker A: You shouldn't be doing it tomorrow.
[01:00:15] Speaker B: A judgy tone in the voice there says, we will, but yeah, no, yeah, we don't do Valentine's. But for us personally. But some people I know that's also coming up. But yeah, have a holy then. And we'll be back in the middle of then when we next come back to you and we will talk about some of that stuff like the hot cross buns and the stations of the cross, and we'll answer those questions that we didn't get to today. God bless everyone.
[01:00:38] Speaker A: See you next time.
The little flock is a joint production of the Lifenet Charitable Trust and left foot media.
[01:00:52] Speaker B: If you enjoyed this show, then please help us to ensure that more of this great content keeps getting made by becoming a patron of the show at Forward slash left foot media.
[01:01:03] Speaker A: Thanks for listening. See you next time on the little flock.
