23. Gaming Addiction & Dealing With Family Political Differences

[00:00:06] Speaker A: Hi, my name is Katie Malone. [00:00:07] Speaker B: And I'm Brendan, the husband. [00:00:09] Speaker A: And you're listening to the Little Flock, the podcast that offers practical insights about living a counterculture of goodness, truth and beauty in a world of increasingly hostile secularism and indifference. [00:00:19] Speaker B: So if you're looking to learn from two imperfect followers of Christ about how to live like the wheat amongst the Darnell, this is definitely the podcast for you. Hi, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Little Flock. [00:00:35] Speaker A: Great to be back. [00:00:36] Speaker B: It is, isn't it? It's been a while. [00:00:37] Speaker A: It's always. It's always like that this time of year. [00:00:39] Speaker B: What do the cool kids say? It's been a minute. [00:00:41] Speaker A: Oh, it's been a minute. [00:00:44] Speaker B: We didn't. We didn't have an episode last month because of time constraints and because we. [00:00:49] Speaker A: Can'T remember last month. [00:00:50] Speaker B: Yeah, we woke up and it was almost Christmas. [00:00:53] Speaker A: Yeah, six weeks til Christmas. We're not allowed to talk about that. [00:00:56] Speaker B: Before we get into any of the meat and pot potatoes, another saying of mine. [00:00:59] Speaker A: Oh, very Irish. [00:01:00] Speaker B: Yep, the taties of today's episode. Just a quick reminder that if you are new here and you have not already, please subscribe. If you like the content and you're enjoying it, please share it with friends and family. And if you're listening on a podcast platform that allows you to give us a rating, some stars, a few comments, positive ones, obviously, and just the good stuff we're looking forward. [00:01:23] Speaker A: No negative feedback, please. [00:01:24] Speaker B: That all really helps the show. Send your negative feedback to. This doesn't work at Gmail, so. But yeah, seriously, that all helps the show. Don't forget. 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So if you've got someone that's a bit hard to buy for this Christmas, or you're thinking, hey, I think they'd benefit from a bit of that podcast and that sort of that crazy guy's manic views of the world, then you can buy a guest one year subscription if you want to. Patreon.com Left Foot Media Alrighty. So with that out of the way, notice is over. Did you have notices in class? Was that a development? Yeah, yeah. And when I was at school, they didn't really do notice as much. There was like, if a notice came over the wires, it was. It was serious. Like, you know, all of the senior male students who were on the rugby trip yesterday must report to the hall for a conversation with the principal after this period. You know, that kind of a thing. And it was normally me, or maybe the PA would burst into life, but you did all your notices at, like, homeroom. Now they're just pumping them out all over the place, it seems. [00:04:07] Speaker A: Oh, the kids have got them all on their devices. [00:04:10] Speaker B: Yeah, more notices. Student portal house. Yeah, that's true. Yeah. They come home now, it's like, hey, I left school, stop sending me notices. We've got a couple of articles that we want to start with, Katie, before we get into any questions that have been sent into us to consider. And this one we thought we'd talk about because we both had a little chuckle when we read it. But there is also a deeper issue here that is, I think, worthy of our consideration. Let me Read to you the headline Kiwi woman reveals why she chose to marry herself. So would you, if you had your time over, would you marry yourself? [00:04:43] Speaker A: Absolutely not. [00:04:45] Speaker B: Why not? You're not. [00:04:47] Speaker A: I'm not easy to live with. I don't see a future. [00:04:53] Speaker B: Yeah. Not doesn't really meet. [00:04:55] Speaker A: The dates haven't been up there, you know, no spark. [00:05:01] Speaker B: Oh man. Yeah. And I think I also might be stealing my food from the fridge at night when no one else is looking. Let's have a read of this fascinating article. [00:05:09] Speaker A: I haven't asked myself how do you do that? [00:05:12] Speaker B: You get down on one knee. Like half a knee. [00:05:15] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:05:15] Speaker B: Half. You stands and half a knee goes down and oh my gosh, it's mental. In an intimate forest ceremony. We're already off to a good start. [00:05:25] Speaker A: It's a great start to a novel. [00:05:27] Speaker B: Yeah. In an intimate forest ceremony under a canopy of pine trees. Well, whatever. Yeah. Yeah, I guess. What else would there be in a forest but canopy of trees. Jessica Veer watched in a. Sorry. A silver wedding ring slip onto her finger clutching heart. Felt self penned vows in her other hand. The entrepreneur wept and said I do. [00:05:51] Speaker A: I mean who else is going to pen her vows to herself? But okay. [00:05:53] Speaker B: I mean it's. But I suppose you only do one set of vows, wouldn't you? Not two rings. [00:05:58] Speaker A: You're not going to get someone else to write them if you're marrying yourself, are you? [00:06:01] Speaker B: Oh yeah. It's true yourself. Ben. Doesn't he writing this? My imaginary friend Bob. However, in a special twist, there was no actual partner standing with Jessica at the altar. Instead at 2:22pm I don't know why that's relevant. [00:06:16] Speaker A: On Tuesday, numerology. Oh. [00:06:18] Speaker B: February 22, 2022, the kimono wearing bride married herself. I chose that date because it included 5 twos and 5 twos equals 10. [00:06:29] Speaker A: Maths. What? [00:06:32] Speaker B: How did you. What? I suppose 5 times 2 equals 10. Which is all about self love and self leadership. In numerology she says wow. Self devotion ceremonies. She's a devotional witch. [00:06:49] Speaker A: Yeah. This is her business. So this article is actually an ad. [00:06:53] Speaker B: I was fully committing to myself. [00:06:55] Speaker A: Yeah. Because the rest of us aren't. [00:06:59] Speaker B: Yeah. We're really not, are we? Like. Yeah, it's. It's funny. Like we could go on. I don't know if we do we need to read any more? [00:07:04] Speaker A: Read all of it. [00:07:05] Speaker B: Yeah, it's. This is full of goodies. Like a clairvoyant mentioned to Jessica that she had a gift of reading horoscopes. So she began Expanding her knowledge of astrology. I'm sure the clairvoyant did that out of the goodness of his or her heart and didn't charge her 500 an hour or anything for such great pearls of wisdom. But anyway, yes, she's married herself. But here's the thing. I mean, we can chuckle at this, and we did, because there's lots of jokes that could be made about this. How do you divorce? I mean, that's awkward. You divorce yourself and then you're always there. [00:07:40] Speaker A: I don't think you would though, would you? That's the whole point. [00:07:41] Speaker B: My ex wife is hanging around everywhere. I'm in the toilet, she's in there. [00:07:45] Speaker A: But what happens if you get into an actual serious relationship and you have to explain to them that you're already married to yourself? [00:07:52] Speaker B: What if you met someone who'd self married themselves as well? And now avocado. Now you're in a. Was that bigamy or polygamy at that point? I don't know what's going on, it's mental. But I guess the deeper point here is, aside from the chuckles that we're all having about all of this, is the fact that, I mean, there's a tragic element to this. It's kind of like this is a big article in our major newspaper, the Herald, and it's also in the Woman's Day, which kind of maybe is an interesting statement about the quality of our media. Yeah. And women's magazines in general. [00:08:26] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:08:26] Speaker B: And I reckon I'd love to hear your thoughts on this because I reckon there's been a shift. I mean, when I was a kid, my mum used to read the Old Woman's Weekly and the Woman's Day and stuff. And I mean there was always a. Like a gossip campaign. Princess D. What she spammy stuff. Yeah. [00:08:40] Speaker A: Before Clip. Before Clip B existed. [00:08:42] Speaker B: Yeah, that. That was it. Right. But there was also like a serious homemaker kind of component to it as well. [00:08:48] Speaker A: Good recipes. The old woman's. [00:08:50] Speaker B: Yeah. And. And sort of funny jovial stuff and interesting articles about people's lives, but it feels like now it's just evolved into. [00:08:58] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:08:59] Speaker B: Spectacle. I suppose. I mean, I suppose if you saw. [00:09:01] Speaker A: And I'm pretty sure the Women's Day didn't come looking for her, if you get my drift. [00:09:05] Speaker B: Ah, yeah. [00:09:06] Speaker A: Well, she read the whole article. It kind of. To me it smacks of like she set up a. Essentially she set up a devotional. I can't remember what it's called, some kind of self devotion ceremony business where she arranges these ceremonies for people. [00:09:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:09:20] Speaker A: But that was two years ago and I wonder if she hasn't had that many. And this is her way of drumming up some business, you know, look at me and my pretty kimono. I got married to myself in a mirror. You can do it, too. [00:09:30] Speaker B: She's a life coach, isn't she, as well? [00:09:32] Speaker A: Oh, no, she doesn't know. She calls herself a witchy bestie, so she kind of guides people with her New Age. [00:09:37] Speaker B: So she's in a cult practice. Yeah, yeah. Which is obviously, as Christians, we're going to say, hey, no, don't go there. And would you like a. Because we know someone who can help with that. But aside from that, the serious reality here is that this is kind of a. It's an absurdity. Which has been taken seriously, though. [00:09:59] Speaker A: Yep. [00:09:59] Speaker B: Like, it is. There's kind of a spectacle element to it, but they're also like, hey, this could be a valid choice for you. [00:10:04] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. But anything's a valid choice, though, isn't it? [00:10:06] Speaker B: That's. That's exactly. Yeah. And my point is, this is like peak liberalism. [00:10:10] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:10:11] Speaker B: Where it's my body, my choice. I will literally marry my own body. [00:10:15] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:10:16] Speaker B: And then on top of that, if. [00:10:18] Speaker A: I can't have me, nobody else can. [00:10:22] Speaker B: Well, that doesn't end well this week. You should sort of shoot someone or. Yeah. I would never marry again. [00:10:27] Speaker A: But this. Is this not kind of what we're seeing? You know, the 4B stuff in the States? Is this not an early. I mean, she's still got hair, so that's quite good. [00:10:34] Speaker B: Yeah. But see, the 4B, which is the. For those who don't know, it's a movement, actually. It started in Korea. A group of activist women who swore off sex and shaved their heads in protest. [00:10:45] Speaker A: No babies. [00:10:46] Speaker B: Which is. If you know anything about South Korea, they desperately need babies. So that's a. I mean, that is such a. This is literally a suicidal position on so many levels. But there's a group in America now, after the election of Donald Trump, who have really flipped out about that and they've started doing the same thing. And they're wearing Taylor Swift. Her Big Blue concert, is it Eros tour, whatever that tour was, with the beads. And so they know each other, they can identify each other. It's hilarious because these are the same people, which will tell you, oh, my gosh, we're living in the Handmaid's Tale. And then they have literally made themselves into handmaidens of, like, the Democrat political party. It's very odd. But anyway, so yeah, there's sort of, there's a spectacle element to this as well, but it's also being presented as if, hey, you know, this could be something you might consider doing too, if. [00:11:34] Speaker A: You know, you've had failed relationships or just married. This poor woman was definitely taken advantage of by at least one, if not more men. [00:11:42] Speaker B: Oh yeah. [00:11:43] Speaker A: So you can see kind of from that angle. And she lost her father at a young age. Like there's definitely deeper reasons for why you end up and why she might think this is where her genuine happiness lies. [00:11:54] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:11:54] Speaker A: I'm the only person that can make me happy. [00:11:56] Speaker B: Yeah. And she, she talks about she was seeking total self acceptance and self sovereignty, but the, the irony is this, that, I mean, the fact that she's seeking self acceptance speaks to what you're saying. She's, she's broken. [00:12:12] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:12:13] Speaker B: There's a wound here that needs the love of God. [00:12:16] Speaker A: She even acknowledges it. She says that she went looking for love. [00:12:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:19] Speaker A: Wherever she could find her. And then realized that she wasn't getting genuine love. And. But then she settled on the only place for genuine love is me. [00:12:27] Speaker B: Yeah. Self love. [00:12:28] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:12:29] Speaker B: And which is a, which is a serious tragedy. And it speaks to the brokenness of our culture and this whole idea of self sovereignty or personal freedom. Ironically, you actually don't find your own freedom and you don't find the fullness of your own life until you actually give it away. [00:12:44] Speaker A: That's right. [00:12:44] Speaker B: That's a fundamental principle. I mean, Christ tells us that the Greeks in their teachings on virtue understood that it is just fundamentally true. You don't truly know or find yourself without giving of yourself and total self giving love to at least one other person. Like, it doesn't have to be marriage. It could be friendship. It could be a total self giving to God and some higher calling, you know, where you live in singleness. But you can't do it by saying, well, I would just marry myself. [00:13:11] Speaker A: That's right. [00:13:12] Speaker B: And I'll, I'll find myself. And as I said, it's the ultimate sort of liberalism because it's like literally I, I've. Now I've become one with myself in totality. And in the process, and this is the important bit, I'm going to take something that is real and that is not actually mine to treat as property or a commodity marriage. And I will now reduce it to this absurd spectacle because she thinks she's married herself, but she hasn't because this is not a marriage. Marriage is an embodied reality that requires. [00:13:45] Speaker A: Two do you think self care, married on forms? [00:13:48] Speaker B: Well, yeah, it's a bit complicated. [00:13:50] Speaker A: Right. Like, I guess you can identify as married if you want. [00:13:53] Speaker B: Well, I suppose who would ask? [00:13:55] Speaker A: Yeah. But if you have to fill out the partner's name, do you just put your own name? Oh, there's too many questions. [00:13:59] Speaker B: Yeah, this is. Yeah. [00:14:02] Speaker A: She wants to adopt a child in the future. Does she? [00:14:04] Speaker B: Does she? [00:14:05] Speaker A: Wow, I'm a married couple. [00:14:06] Speaker B: Well, yeah. Does she buy two seats on a flight? [00:14:10] Speaker A: Well, probably not. You gotta save money where you can. [00:14:13] Speaker B: So you got yourself a. Well, I was gonna say a chicken with the egg situation, but it's more of a Russian doll, babushka situation. Person within a person here. But. But this is the spectacle and the absurdity of this is that marriage is a sacrament. It's an embodied reality, and it is not a play thing. And this is sort of the end, one of the many ends of people who actually fail to respect a culture that fails to respect and cherish marriage and hold it up for what it actually is, is then you can just reduce it to a plaything and it becomes anything you want. And that's not good for future generations like you hope that no vulnerable or aspirational or, you know, desperately seeking advice. Young woman, look at this and go. Or young men, for that matter. And go. Yeah, I should do that too. Yeah, it's. It's a sign of sadness really, isn't it? Yeah, but, yeah, it's funny, you've got prominence, like, it's massive. It's. And I guess the papers are looking for a bit of clickbait, so. [00:15:07] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. [00:15:08] Speaker B: That's a factor. But clearly this is not treated with disdain. [00:15:13] Speaker A: No, no. [00:15:14] Speaker B: They think that this is possibly something that. That we could all spend our lives doing. Alrighty. Moving right along to something a little bit more. What. What should we say? How should we describe this one? Practical and practical. Yeah, proactively positive. We actually use a really good Internet supervisory tool for our family and we're not being paid to say this, called Custodio, spelled with a Q. Custodio.com I think, is their website, isn't it? And it's a really great tool for keeping an eye on devices and making sure that things, A, don't get looked at, that shouldn't be looked at, and B, you also get updates and alerts about screen time and what's going on, which is quite interesting and helpful to receive. And you can even lock out from remotely your kids if they're breaking the rules too much. Yeah. Which we've had a few issues with over time but they every now and then they put out helpful little articles and there's a great little article that they published earlier this year called how to Help Prevent Gaming Addiction Children. And we thought that we'd talk about that, but before we do, it's not really something that's taken hold yet with our young man, is it? Gaming addiction? [00:16:28] Speaker A: I think it would. If we gave him the leeway he would probably. [00:16:33] Speaker B: Yeah, you can see the. Yeah, you can see the potential there. A definitely because we've been very cautious. [00:16:39] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:16:39] Speaker B: And it's interesting in the last couple of years how, and particularly as his peers have come into that gaming space, he's also suddenly it's just become the thing and, and you can see how like on his school laptop device he has his screen saver and his background is, you know, gaming theme. [00:16:59] Speaker A: Is it? I hadn't noticed that stuff. [00:17:00] Speaker B: Yes. So it's, it's. Yeah, you can see the potential out of nowhere. It's sort of, you know, and I think particularly for young boys, eh? [00:17:08] Speaker A: Yeah. Although even Eleanor this morning said all of my friends are talking about Roblox in front of me and it's not fair because I don't have it. [00:17:14] Speaker B: Ah, yeah. Interesting. [00:17:16] Speaker A: Probably not going to happen. [00:17:17] Speaker B: So that's the. [00:17:18] Speaker A: Based on everything I've read, it's funny. [00:17:20] Speaker B: How there's a gateway now, right? [00:17:21] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:17:22] Speaker B: So like when I was younger there wasn't really. It was like there was no gaming and then there was gaming. [00:17:27] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:17:28] Speaker B: And then now it's like something that starts very young because the devices are so portable and personal and they just. [00:17:35] Speaker A: So intuitive and easy for them to like you can give a two year old a tablet and they can figure it out pretty quick. [00:17:39] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:17:40] Speaker A: Like it doesn't take much. [00:17:41] Speaker B: No. And then so you got Roblox, you. [00:17:44] Speaker A: Know, like it was a bit more complicated in the 80s. [00:17:47] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:17:47] Speaker A: And I remember playing lots of Mission Impossible though, my Commodore 64. [00:17:51] Speaker B: Oh, the Commodore 64. Well, back in the day when you had to take. Did you have a floppy drive or was it tape drive? Oh yeah, we had a tape. [00:17:58] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:17:59] Speaker B: The first computer we owned because we were quite a poor family and someone gave it to us and I can see why it was Commodore 161 6, not 64. There weren't even 64 bits, there was 16 and you had a tape player and you pressed play on the tape to load a game and 40 minutes later some very basic game would appear on your screen and you'd think this was. Whoa I'm a master programmer. Yeah. But interestingly, even back then, like you would, we would get books out about how to write basic code programs and that you couldn't save them on those computers, the tape ones, but you would spend like an hour writing out lines and lines of code so that it would like a line would appear on the screen and go wee and make a noise and you'd think, whoa. But so you kind of, you were learning some skills. Yeah, not anymore. It's now just hardcore straight into gaming. But what I'm saying is I guess that the gaming pathway is there from very young. [00:18:55] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:18:56] Speaker B: And even things like. Is it Minecraft in school and stuff? It's. [00:19:00] Speaker A: Yeah, they have Minecraft education. Yeah. [00:19:03] Speaker B: But I think that's a very clever ploy on the part of Minecraft to sell their game educational. So yeah, it is an issue. And let's read from this article. In an age where almost everyone has a phone in their pocket, video gaming is more common than ever before. Many people, it's amazing too. I don't. When you travel, I'm on a plane often I will see like really, you know, fully grown adults older than me who are, who are sitting there playing games for the whole flight. Yeah, it's quite interesting. Most many people, sorry, especially children and teenagers, find video gaming to be an enjoyable pastime and social activity. However, did you know that about 2% of children and adolescents are addicted to video games? That's a lot of kids. When you think about how many kids are playing video games. For some children, video games can become more than just a fun activity and begin to cause a number of problems in their lives. As parents, it's important to recognize and know how to stop gaming addiction in order to help children develop healthy technology habits as they grow. And one thing I think it's important to know here is that not all games are created equal. So what, what games you were playing? Mission Impossible. [00:20:04] Speaker A: Yeah. Loved it when he like died and screamed ah. [00:20:07] Speaker B: The whole way down and you're on a monochrome screen. Were you on the TV? [00:20:10] Speaker A: No, it was on a Commodore 64. [00:20:12] Speaker B: So pretty basic sort of graphics, right? [00:20:15] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:16] Speaker B: So hyper realistic graphics make a difference. It's very immersive. And also games that have what are sometimes called loot boxes, but basically any sort of reward. So you get to a certain thing and you can open something or you earn so many points and you get to buy more. What happens is your brain is getting dopamine. [00:20:34] Speaker A: Hits Roblox like that, eh? Right. Like the one Ellie was Asking about, because I looked it up again. And even Common Sense Media, which has gone a little bit more liberal in the last couple years, I think has recommends it for 13 plus. [00:20:47] Speaker B: Interesting. [00:20:48] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:20:49] Speaker B: So it's something to be aware of. And particularly when they're very young, before they've had what's called synaptic or neural pruning. The brain is sort of still figuring out how best to use and create neural pathways and how to use its energy. And there are periods of pruning that it goes through key points round puberty is one, for example. And what happens is the brain goes, well, we don't need those pathways because they're not being used and we'll focus our energy and we'll just prune away. And so at those stages are a bit more vulnerable because addictions can actually fall a bit deeper. Yeah, it's. Yeah. And it's just. It's something to be aware of. Like, you know, like if your kids playing. Like our kids are playing, what are they playing at the moment? They have goldeneye on the Wii. [00:21:27] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. [00:21:28] Speaker B: That's a very different proposition. Or even saying something like Space Invaders. [00:21:34] Speaker A: They like Mario Kart too. [00:21:35] Speaker B: Yeah, Mario Kart. That. Those are very different propositions to full immersive narrative gaming, which has a complete story arc. Or again, different to gaming where they're full of loot, boxes and rewards and. Yeah, it's like Fortnite's another one. They're not all the same. So I think it's important to recognize that too. They're not. All things are equal in this regard. What is gaming addiction? Gaming addiction is commonly referred to as Internet gaming disorder. IGD and is characterized by spending at least 8 to 10 hours per day playing video games. And I. [00:22:08] Speaker A: 8 to 10 hours a day. [00:22:09] Speaker B: I know and I tell you, but I have. I haven't. I've met with people. I have worked with people, young guys previously where I was, had management, where they would go home at night. [00:22:19] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:22:20] Speaker B: And they would spend. [00:22:21] Speaker A: So it's like the wee hours. [00:22:22] Speaker B: They. Yeah, they would like. Imagine you have your dinner and you crack into video gaming. Or maybe you'd start before dinner and then have dinner and then go carry on after dinner. And then you just carry on at the early hours of the morning and then you get up for work the next day. People with IGD use video games as an escape from real life problems or unpleasant tasks. And. Well, also, let's. I think this is interesting. This is the sort of therapeutic thing that's True. But it's also often you. And you've got to recognize the game itself is addictive. It's. It's. You're getting dopamine hits from it. Yeah. It's. Especially if it's an immersive experience and you enjoy and I think particularly young men in certain arenas, the challenge of it. Yeah, there's a challenge in young men and men in general. Like challenges. Children and teens with IGD often choose to play video games rather than complete schoolwork, chores or spend time with friends. I mean that's. [00:23:12] Speaker A: Yeah, the first two. They probably choose a lot of things. [00:23:14] Speaker B: Yeah. You didn't choose that. [00:23:15] Speaker A: Anyway. [00:23:16] Speaker B: This can create a variety of academic, social and developmental issues. [00:23:19] Speaker A: Although I think they would argue in some cases because a lot of those games, particularly addictive ones now have a community aspect to them. So I have to play Fortnite because my team or whatever. Don't ask me because I don't know how Fortnite works. But I understand that you're kind of supporting other people in the game. Like there's a community to it. Yeah. [00:23:38] Speaker B: And it's. And even adult gaming. I know we've got a couple of friends of ours who are. And they're very. They're controlled gamers. They're not addicts at all. And they play those team based online games and they, they join servers where these people are. And they've been journeying with them, I guess in this fun gaming experience after hours for years, some of them. So. Yeah. And you can see how that could be compelling. I've actually seen people say I got online but no one was there. So I just logged off. Because that was more the interest than the. [00:24:08] Speaker A: Yeah, the connection. [00:24:08] Speaker B: It was just kind of interesting actually. But then the danger is that you spend all your time online, you don't form authentic community. [00:24:14] Speaker A: I have met someone recently who has done. Is now on her second international trip with a group of friends. She met Gaynor. So they've actually gone out and meet each other in real life and now they're going traveling together. I find that really interesting. [00:24:26] Speaker B: I think my experiences and I mean this is a general rule. There are exceptions that prove the rule, I guess. But my experience has been that woman in general approach gaming very differently to men. [00:24:38] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:24:39] Speaker B: And I mean, I'm not surprised by that. But it's interesting the way the communal aspect is kind of different. They actually, it seems that woman gamers look for not just different things in their games but also in the experience itself. So. Yeah. They talk about age Factors, sorry, risk factors here. And age is one, because apparently it's more prevalent in children and teenage. Because they're exposed to video games at a much younger age. And this is what I was saying earlier, actually, when their brains are not yet fully developed, children have a harder time dealing with uncomfortable feelings in situations than adults and so may seek out video games as an escape. Again, I think that's secondary, though. I think what you're dealing with here is a young brain that is easily pulled into behavioral addictions. And this is a very compelling. Yeah, it's got a lot ticks, a lot of boxes. Video gamings, family situation. Children with poor relationships with their parents are also more likely to develop gaming addiction. These types of relationships can mean less supervision over electronics usage and can give children another reason to overuse video games. So that's a reminder again, what if you're a parent and you're listening or you're going to be a parent one day, hopefully, if that's your calling, then make sure that you, you know, you're engaged. [00:25:46] Speaker A: Yeah. Know what they're doing, know what they're doing online. [00:25:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:25:49] Speaker A: And I don't have an issue if you've got kids that come home from school, have some food and maybe play a game for half an hour, you know, I don't have a problem with that. But if you, if they're doing it, oh, I'm going to my bedroom, Mum, to do my homework. [00:26:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:26:02] Speaker A: And they don't come back for four hours and, oh, surprise, surprise, the end of the week, homework's not done. [00:26:06] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:26:07] Speaker A: You might want to question what they're doing in their bedroom for four hours. [00:26:10] Speaker B: Well, I think it's also even the basics of saying, look, tell me about that game that you enjoy at the moment. And sort of. So part of it is forming the relationship, but also understanding what's going on. And also I think it's. It creates the possibility if they encounter stuff that's not good, they're more likely to talk to you because you've already got that sort of relationship with them. Yeah. Mental health, and this is an interesting one, research shows that children with ADHD and depressive symptoms are also much more likely to develop gaming addictions. Now, but here's the interesting thing. The research also shows us that it's the other way too. So you can actually exacerbate problems or create mental health problems by an overuse. [00:26:51] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, yeah. [00:26:52] Speaker B: So, yeah, yeah. And the question is, are you seeing correlation and confusing it with causation here and thinking, oh, They've got ADHD and that's causing them to look at the video games, when in actual fact, maybe the video games are creating, for example, the depressive symptoms or exacerbating that problem. Number four, time spent on gaming. Well, that's obviously children who spend more than 240 minutes playing video games each day. So that's two four hours. Four hours? Yeah, I was gonna say two. I was counting that wrong. [00:27:25] Speaker A: Aspirin. [00:27:25] Speaker B: Yeah, it is. Yeah, it is two full four hours. So, yeah, two lots of 120. That's right, isn't it? So four hours each day have been identified as particularly at risk for gaming addiction. I would say you're probably already at the gaming addiction phase if you're spending four hours a day. [00:27:40] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:27:41] Speaker B: On just that one task. [00:27:44] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:27:44] Speaker B: Unless your job is to be a computer programmer and you're paid to do that, then. Then I. Yeah, I honestly, I think that's. Yeah, yeah. So no surprise there. The more time they spend, the more they want to, actually. And here she goes. She's mentioned in this article many multiplayer online games with reward, which reward players for this habit, you know, can be compulsive. And so social skills. Children have not developed their social skills enough, may also seek video games as an alternative to interacting with others in real life. Like what? Again, what I think's happening here is the video game has not been recognised perhaps as the source of this problem. [00:28:20] Speaker A: Again, it's cyclical. They find it easier to interact with the game and then the game stops them from being able to interact because they don't develop social skills. [00:28:29] Speaker B: Yeah. Or I think what happens is, if you're, particularly if you're young enough, we stick a device in your hand and that interferes with your brain cognitive and social development in ways that are not healthy. And then we say, oh, they're looking for this as a therapeutic end, but in actual fact, it's the cause. But they helpfully, they sort of list some signs of warning signs of gaming addiction. I mean, obviously there's things like if they're spending four hours on four hours or more a day, for example, if you notice that your child has begun to fall behind in their school or isn't getting the grades they used to, you might consider checking up on their daily electronics use. If there isn't another clear cause of the issue. You could similarly keep an eye on them throughout the day to help stop gaming addiction. But for many families, this just isn't possible. And, you know, they're out of sight, obviously, for a While. And they've talked about parental control tool and custodial, they're obviously going to recommend it because that's, you know, one of the tools. This is the website, their website. This article's on. But we use it, we've found it helpful. I know there are others out there. [00:29:24] Speaker A: There are definitely other ones out there. [00:29:27] Speaker B: This can be an easy and effective way to help set time limits and prevent children from playing games for too long. You can also do that by, by just using. Now, most computers have parental controls on them and so they're built in. You can just set that and set time limits. And as long as you make sure that you create an account, a master account that has control that only you have access to and then give them a separate user account on the computer so they can't change those settings, they say. Additionally, you may find that your child struggles with poor mood and behaviour when they have to, when, sorry, have to be done playing games. This is another important warning sign that they're using video games to get away from dealing with. [00:30:03] Speaker A: That goes for any device usage as far as I've seen. Like, it doesn't matter what they're doing on that screen the minute you tell them to turn it off. [00:30:11] Speaker B: Now, there's a reason for that and this article doesn't talk about this, but there is a reason for that. We know now that children don't react with narrative device use the way they do after they come off any sort of gaming or just regular device use that's not narrative driven. So in other words, if you put your kids down in front of a screen to watch a film or an episode, they won't have that reaction when the episode comes to an end. But they will with the device because the brain is engaging differently with a game and this is important to understand. So if you're thinking, oh man, I, you know, I don't want to be sort of overly judicious and I, I remember as a kid what, you know, having screen time after school. Sure. But think about the nature of the screen time because not all screen time is equal. So rather than just sticking them on a device, say, why don't you watch an episode or a movie that's actually going to be better for their brains and you will find you won't have that problem. The only problem you have to deal with is, can I watch another episode? [00:31:11] Speaker A: And in our house, it's really good for negotiation skills because they all have to agree, yeah, yeah, that's right. That can take half an hour in itself. It's great activity. [00:31:18] Speaker B: Yeah. So. And that's, that's, that is, that's so true. They have. They had a jar for a while, didn't they? [00:31:22] Speaker A: We did the jar system for a while. [00:31:24] Speaker B: They pulled a name out of the jar. [00:31:25] Speaker A: Out of the jar. And you don't get to argue and can't be something that scares someone else. And then of course, everybody was scared of Barbie. That movie scares me. [00:31:34] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. That was. There was some suspicious suddenly developing of phobias when certain movies that they'd never had before they just didn't like and suddenly they had a phobia. Oh no, I'm afraid of that movie. Oh, it's got a scary scene in it. They watched it 20 times. Yeah. And it is now they have the rule we've got now, by the way, that's if you can hear rain, folks. It started to. On Katie's washing. But they've. Now the situation is they have to all agree. They come to an agreement about what movie they will watch. And it's, you know, some days are better than others, but it's. It's good. It's good. Here's the thing, ways to prevent gaming addiction. They talk about. It's crucial to seek and communicate expectations about electronics use. And so that's on a daily basis. And being aware of that, creating an agreement between you and your child about where and when electronics can be used helps to educate your child on healthy habits. We've got that a. With our kids, no devices in bedrooms. It can also be very helpful to implement an app like Custodial. Obviously they're trying to promote their app, but it is definitely, I would say now it's sort of a given. You've got to have some sort of supervisory software. And it's not necessarily even your kids, it's how the technology will interact with them without you even knowing what's going on. You know, and that's not. Not a good thing. There's enough horror stories out there to say, look, we do need to be careful about this. And so, yeah, I think key things like setting time limits, setting expectations about where devices can be used and then just having good oversight like they've talked about here. And then they talk about how to deal with gaming addiction. And I think this is a bit more serious. Right. Because it depends where they're at. And if it's just sort of a basic thing, they're spending far too much time online. [00:33:15] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:33:16] Speaker B: And you sort of need to crib that back then. That's really just a Matter of having a conversation, making some new boundaries and then the hard bit, enforcing them. [00:33:25] Speaker A: That's right, that is the hard bit. [00:33:28] Speaker B: It really is, eh? And both parents have got to be on board with that because. Oh, boy, that is one of the points now where they're like, let's go to Mum and see what she says. Okay, let's try dad now. But we won't tell dad that we've been to Mum. That's a very common little. So, you know, I understand now why my parents used to say, have you asked your dad, you asked your mum? Work with them to develop coping, healthy coping strategies for issues they're facing while educating them on the dangers of turning to unhealthy activities. They talk about parental controls. That's true. And if you've got gaming addiction, you're going to have to have a bit more of an involvement. But I think too, one of the things that we can do is actually help them to foster good relationships outside of the screen. And I remember a couple of years ago I read Nicholas Kadaris book, Glow Kids. Very good book. He's like considered one of the top addiction experts in the world, actually. And it was all about screen addiction. And he told this story about a case that he'd had in his therapeutic practice where a mum had brought her son because of gaming addiction. And it was his had got teenage boy, it had got so serious, he'd got to the sort of psychosis stage where he would shut off the game, but he wasn't sure what was real and what wasn't. Like his brain was so tuned in. Yeah. Like he thought some of the stuff was still happening around him and thankfully he came out of it. But what happens is he starts playing basketball that he figures out. Working with him in a therapeutic setting, basketball and being with a team, that's a great thing. And so. But then the mum got angry with him and the therapist and said, oh, no, no, I don't want them outside, it's not safe. And like he was saying, you can't have both. You've got to actually have a bit of risk and you've got to have a bit of communal engagement. And sometimes as parents we have to help facilitate that. [00:35:11] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:35:12] Speaker B: So whether that's play dates or I guess, driving them to youth group and sort of making it easy for them to build those, you know, actual genuine pathways of communion with other people. [00:35:24] Speaker A: So, yeah, I would say also something like, you know, if you're weaning off games, the Wii has been really good for that. In our family and having. [00:35:37] Speaker B: That's a Nintendo Wii for those Wii. [00:35:39] Speaker A: Any kind of thing where you can actually have like multiple player. So like Nathaniel have a made over and they might play. What was it you mentioned before? [00:35:46] Speaker B: Oh, Golden Eye or the four person Mario Karts or the sports games. They. [00:35:51] Speaker A: They're bowling with people. [00:35:52] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:53] Speaker A: But playing games is kind of a best of the. Yeah, yeah. [00:35:57] Speaker B: What's great, like we noticed particularly when from very young age actually once they figured out the mechanics of it, the body mechanics of bowling, the bowling game tempo, bowling. What was great about that game was you took your turn, then you sit down and wait and there's other people there. And it's not. You're constantly stuck to the screen. It's. It's actually instilling sort of delayed gratification mechanisms into you and everything. It's. Yeah, so that's a great. That is a great point. The other thing that we've found interesting and helpful is like just dance. Oh, yeah, just dance. And it's interesting. I came in the other day and I thought, oh, are they playing Wii? But no, it wasn't. A couple of the girls had Just Dance on and Just Dance has those. The silhouetted figures, aren't. [00:36:35] Speaker A: They show you the moves, you choose. [00:36:37] Speaker B: The music and you press play. And then the silhouetted figures on the screen, you've got to imitate them dancing and do the moves and yeah, it's. It's amazing. [00:36:45] Speaker A: Great time. They love watching dad try and do. What were you. What were you doing? [00:36:48] Speaker B: What were you doing? There was the rush. [00:36:49] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [00:36:50] Speaker B: Moscow. Moscow. And they thought it was hilarious, you know, not bad, I have to say. I for one will be ready for our Russian overlords. [00:36:58] Speaker A: It's a really good. Sometimes when Eleanor's having a hard morning or a hard day, that's a really good reset tool, that one. [00:37:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:37:03] Speaker A: Because it's the music and the movement. [00:37:05] Speaker B: And her older sister actually even joins in with her and it's. Yeah, it seems to work. So, you know, that's been quite helpful. And as I said, don't, don't be afraid of narrative. [00:37:13] Speaker A: That's right. [00:37:14] Speaker B: Screen time. You know that it's not all screen time is equal. So just. Yeah, be aware of that. Alrighty, Katie. So that music means it's time for our scripture reflection and our moment of goodness, truth and beauty for the month. Katie, you go first. What is your moment of goodness, truth or beauty? Because I went first last time, I think, didn't I? Are you sure you made me go first I mean, I'm ready. This is not me. Desperately struggling and Googling, you know, something good, true and beautiful. It was awesome. [00:37:57] Speaker A: What happened in the last month, Last two months. Yeah. Mine was when we went last week to watch our daughter Maddie and her very, very cheesy, very melodramatic melodrama. It's got, as part of her year 10 drama assessment. [00:38:10] Speaker B: Drama. [00:38:11] Speaker A: And actually all three of our girls, our older girls, I reckon, have got a. Got quite a talent for the stage and theatre. [00:38:18] Speaker B: Yes. [00:38:18] Speaker A: And public speaking. [00:38:19] Speaker B: Yeah. Voice projection is how you tell. [00:38:21] Speaker A: No surprise with you, but, you know, with the dad they have. But of those three, Maddie is the one who loves it, is passionate about it, you know, like, that's just her happy place. And it was so beautiful because we knew she'd be excited about it. She got up that morning and I was like, are you feeling nervous? She's like, I'm so excited. [00:38:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:38:38] Speaker A: And she just was in her element, wasn't she, really? And just seeing her perform. [00:38:43] Speaker B: Yeah. And she was one of the two best actors. [00:38:49] Speaker A: They had a crew, two people you could hear. [00:38:51] Speaker B: Yeah. She was projecting her voice. She was really invested in her lines and, yeah, it was. There was real sort of life and vivaciousness to the. Some of the others were a bit nervous. Some of the others were just there because they had to be. [00:39:04] Speaker A: Everybody's met here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's funny because she said that her teacher kept saying, your big sister Lucy was the best. I've never seen anybody as good at learning lines as Lucy. So she had this. Already had these big boots to fill kind of thing. [00:39:15] Speaker B: That's. Gosh, that's pressure, isn't it? Yeah, but that was. Yeah, she did well and. And she was so full of joy. [00:39:21] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. [00:39:22] Speaker B: That was really beautiful, wasn't it? Was just. I mean, I was proud of her because she just did so well. [00:39:26] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:39:26] Speaker B: But also. Yeah, she was. She was just bouncing around at a static afterwards with joy for about a day or so. [00:39:32] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. [00:39:33] Speaker B: So, yeah, she's pretty happy about that. She wants a future in the theater, so we'll see how that pans out, but who knows? But, yeah, that was. That's good. My moment of goodness. Truth or Beauty is actually a really beautiful song that I have returned to lately. And it just. I was listening to it recently and I thought, yeah, that's. That's worthy of a mention. It's by. I say her name is Sarah, but it could be Sarah. [00:39:58] Speaker A: Sarah. It depends if you're talking to Michael McIntyre or not. Because there's Sarah. Sarah without an H. Yeah. [00:40:04] Speaker B: So it could be Sarah Groves. Sarah Groves is great. Phenomenal. She's Christian, she's a singer, songwriter, and very, very talented from my younger years. You may or may not know of her if you're in my sort of age demographic, but she's got this beautiful song called Roll to the Middle. And I just like. She has a real gift for not just melody, but also for lyrical turns and, you know, writing. She's quite good at that. But this one's called Roll to the Middle and it's about a couple and an argument and this married couple. And it's really beautifully put. And let me read it to you. We just had a World War Three here in our kitchen. We both thought the meanest things and then we both said them. Every married couple goes, oh, yeah, we've had one of those moments. We shot at each other till we lost ammunition. This is how I know our love this is when I feel its power here in the absence of it. This is my darkest hour when both of us are hunkered down and waiting for the truce. All the complicated wars, they end pretty simple here when the lights go down we roll to the middle no matter how my pride resists no matter how this wall feels true no matter how I can't be sure that you're going to roll into no matter what no matter what I'm going to reach for you and it's such a beautiful, poetic sort of story about a couple and a very typical experience of a couple have had a dispute, a disagreement, a blow up, and then they, you know, they are in bed together and they roll to the middle and they just resolve the problem and that love returns. And what I love about the song in particular is how she enunciates this important principle about how you know the love is real when its absence actually hurts. And I think that's a bit. We often forget that. And why I thought I'd share this is because we can forget this. We think, oh, our marriage is not perfect, Our relationship's not perfect. And my relationship with my kids and I just blew up again. If you feel bad about that, that's a really healthy sign that there is something real there. The moment you're like, I don't care. That's when you know that you are no longer loving and you've put yourself. You've married yourself in that moment. Right? You put yourself first. And. And what she's actually talking about here is this idea of rupture and repair. How if you have a relationship with someone that is ruptured and then repaired, even just like in a small way of the fight or whatever, you know, blow up at the kids, and then you have to sort of go and say, hey, look, dad was a little bit loud and noisy and he shouldn't have got so angry with their person when we like. But let's address the underlying issue, and I promise not to try not to do that again. And I'm sorry, you know, that kind of thing, that rupture and repair will actually create a stronger relationship than if you didn't have the rupture. And I just. Yeah, really, it's. And it's a beautiful song. I wish I could play it to you, but I think we'll probably get a copyright strike. You can find her on the Spotify and probably on YouTube as well. But Sarah Groves. S, A, R A and Groves is G, R O V E S. And look for roll to the middle. I guarantee you you will go. Yeah. This is a really beautiful little ballad about the ordinary stuff about marriage. Okay, so scripture reflection for the month. [00:43:29] Speaker A: Is it me first again, is it? Yeah, Mine's nice and short. [00:43:34] Speaker B: That's good. [00:43:36] Speaker A: It's from 1 Corinthians, chapter 15, verse 58. The very last verse of the chapter. [00:43:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:43:42] Speaker A: Therefore, my beloved brothers, be firm, steadfast, always fully devoted to the work of the Lord, knowing that in the Lord your labor is not in vain. It's just something that popped up on an Insta post, and I went and looked it up because it really struck a call with me about. And we can get. Especially as mums, you know, we can get bogged down in all the little things you have to do. And I think just really being aware of making your work a prayer, you offer it to the Lord and you say, you know, don't let this be for nothing. Let this be for your glory. [00:44:14] Speaker B: That's beautiful. And it's how I think the ordinary sacramental nature of love and married and family life plays out. Right? Is cleaning toilets and. [00:44:24] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:44:25] Speaker B: Making lunches. And poor Katie, because she. I. I don't know. We have this constant back and forth about this because I'm like, look, man, don't make a rod for your own back. But she's such a beautiful mum. She's like, oh, no, I've got to make three different dinners each night because of all the tastes. Not every night, but some nights. And I'm like, no, just tell them this is it. And. But, yeah, so it's all that kind of stuff is. Yeah, that's beautiful. That's, you know, God, as always. What's that quote you've got? I got you for birthday a couple of years ago. It's on the wall. [00:44:56] Speaker A: God walks among. Walks amongst the pots and pans. [00:44:58] Speaker B: Yeah, God walks among the pots and pans. It's true. [00:45:01] Speaker A: And St. Francis of Rome, who said or something about every housewife. I mean, take that as you will in this day and age, but sometimes has to leave the altar to find God and her work. [00:45:11] Speaker B: Yeah, that's beautiful. My scripture reflection is from Mark, chapter 10. And it's that passage. I won't read it, but I'll just explain it. And you're probably familiar with it already, but where James and John approach Jesus and they say, hey, look, you know, we want to sit at your left and right hand, you know, can we get those spots, please? Not realizing what they're asking. [00:45:34] Speaker A: Dot com. [00:45:34] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, take a tick. Yeah, put your name in the jar and we'll see what happens. And Christ obviously turns to them and says, can you take the baptism that I'm about to take? And you know, the Son of man, because he's talking about the Son of man and his glory. And clearly they're not quite understanding at that stage, it appears what he's meaning. And what he's meaning is the cross. Whenever you see him, sorry, and hear him talking about, you know, his glory in the. In the Gospels, he's talking about the crucifixion, and he's about to go to his glory. And I think it will, you know, left and right, because these are places of honor in the Jewish tradition. And Jesus says, look, you know, can you really take those places? Now, the reason why, I mean, there's lots we could say about that passage, but I mean, not just the fact that James and John do end up like John is exiled on Patmos for life, and that's his baptism of suffering. James is one of the first martyrs. You know, it doesn't take long for him to follow quickly after Christ in that regard. But also, there's this beautiful. As I was reflecting on this, in actual fact, when Christ goes to his glory, his left and his right hand, there are two thieves. It's not even any of his disciples who go with him. And even more than that, what does Christ do on the cross? So one of those thieves is ridiculing him. The other one is asking for his ministry. And what does Christ do? He ministers to him on the cross. So while Christ is suffering he's still ministering to other people. But it dawned on me the beautiful nature of this and how appropriate this was, because imagine. It's not something I've ever thought about before, but imagine if Christ had gone to his cross and he did have James and John crucified beside him, it wouldn't quite be the total abandonment and isolation this is. This was total abandonment. He's. He goes alone to this moment. He has no. He doesn't even have a friend beside him. And there's something really beautiful and important about that. And it just. Yeah, it really struck me as quite important. I mean, aside from the reminder that we shouldn't be seeking glory, but when you follow Christ, the example is even in our suffering, we still have something or someone to minister to. So, yeah, that's my scripture reflection for the month. Alrighty, so let's jump into our questions. Katie, three questions, all very practical, as per usual. Number one, how can we handle differing and strongly held political views in a family? And I guess in light of the American election, where there are now people who are literally getting online and tweeting that they are cutting off family members. One of the worst examples I saw was an adult son who said, I am not going to actually provide any financial or health assistance to my mum because she voted for Trump. [00:48:28] Speaker A: Oh, that's awful. [00:48:28] Speaker B: That is insane. [00:48:29] Speaker A: I saw a video of a couple who only five people up to their. [00:48:32] Speaker B: Wedding because they voted for Trump. [00:48:33] Speaker A: Because they voted for Trump. [00:48:35] Speaker B: Look, honestly, you know, you're in a cult when you are behaving that way. It doesn't matter which way you vote and whether you're inside or outside of America, irrelevant. That is demonic, that kind of behavior. And you know who loves that? Satan loves it. [00:48:49] Speaker A: Absolutely. [00:48:50] Speaker B: And you might be sitting there going, I'm the righteous one and I'm showing them the path of truth. No, you're not. It's just so. And answer that question. Don't do that. Yeah, don't do that. But how do we handle differing and strong? [00:49:02] Speaker A: I mean, we've got this. I don't know if I would define necessarily. All of you know, our family's opinions are strongly held. I think in general, our family is probably quite good at having not. I mean, I don't mean our immediate family, because the girls are still our kids. [00:49:16] Speaker B: All pretty much. Yeah. See the world similar. [00:49:18] Speaker A: I mean, yeah, that might change as they get older, but certainly in our extended families, people have differing opinions. [00:49:26] Speaker B: Yeah. And quite divergent. [00:49:27] Speaker A: But I don't on some big issues. But I Don't think we're pretty good at having conversations that are quite civil. There have been one or two occasions I can remember. [00:49:34] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:49:35] Speaker A: Around Covid stuff where it's been very fractious. But even then, if people stepped over the line, there were apologies issued and, you know, like. Yeah. Trying to see things from the other person's point of view. [00:49:48] Speaker B: Sometimes you've got it. Like, that's an example where sometimes you've actually got to grin and bear it. [00:49:52] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:49:53] Speaker B: And what happens is, I found at the time I copped because I was very public, too, in some of my stances on what I thought was absolutely immoral about what the government was doing and where it was crossing lines, and also my stance on the issue of, you know, what are appropriate forms of, you know, state assistance and help when it comes to health interventions. And what is crossing the line, like, when you try and force people to do things. And so I was very public on that. And so there were people who really. I mean, even in our church. Right. [00:50:23] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:50:24] Speaker B: There were people who just. You could either they would either sort of get antsy about it or they would just avoid you and things like that. And I just. I was confident I knew where my line was and I knew what was right and what wasn't, and I just held the line. And what's interesting is, as things have shifted now, the fear's gone out of it, and people have started to see the daylight a bit more clearly now. Those relationships, a lot of them have come back online and people have actually realized, you know, and so you just sort of. Sometimes you've got to grin and bear it. You got to go, okay, I just know this is the truth. I can't necessarily change anything. I'm not going to live the lie and I'm not going to compromise. So I've just got to be charitable myself. Yeah. So that. That's. That's a Covid thing. [00:51:04] Speaker A: I think charity is a really important point. And I think one thing that I would say is you may have a strong opinion about, for example, Trump or in New Zealand at the moment. David Seymour. [00:51:16] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:51:17] Speaker A: Your conversations should always be civil and charitable, and they should not be attacking the person. One of the things that frustrates me the most is when people go against Trump, but it's personal attack. It's not got anything to do with policy or true understanding of politics. And same for New Zealand, you know, there's a personal attack on someone. Yeah. That for me is. [00:51:37] Speaker B: Yeah, well, and I think that's a good point. Because what happens is no matter who the politician. Same with Ardern. Oh, she's just a tyrant. Like, if that's your argument, what's gonna happen is the person who thinks that that politician is actually a good politician and they like their policies, they will identify with that person and they will take that on as a personal slight. [00:51:57] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [00:51:58] Speaker B: They won't just hear you voicing your views. They will think you're like, I remember this happened with actually one of your younger. Not youngest, but one of your younger brothers, years ago, before Trump was first even in office. Yeah. He was on the verge, I think, of being elected first time. Yeah, yeah. And he just didn't understand, like, he. He had probably a very passing appreciation based on what the media would say about American affairs, American culture, what's going on there, and who Trump was. And he just spoke out from that perspective, and I don't blame him. That's just, you know, that's. Was his. What he was exposed to, and he just said that, you know, he's this, he's that. No, no coherent arguments. Just. He's an idiot. He's a. This is that. And. And what. When I'm. I'm listening to something and. Yeah, basically what I'm hearing is you think I'm an idiot as well. Because I've said. I think. Well, not. I think I understand why people have voted for this man. And if I was in America and I had these two choices, Hillary Clinton at the time and him, I would have voted for him as well. And so, you know, like, it's. People don't hear it as an argument. They just hear you calling them. [00:53:04] Speaker A: That's right. [00:53:04] Speaker B: Names and. [00:53:05] Speaker A: Yeah, that's right. Attack it on board. [00:53:06] Speaker B: So that's one thing to consider. I guess part of it, too, is knowing when to actually just have silence. Like, you don't. You don't have to have. [00:53:14] Speaker A: Share your opinion about everything. That's right. Yeah. In fact, one of my friends going back to the COVID stuff, she said they wrote a list for Christmas because I was so sick of talking about COVID with everybody. And I think it was them. And like, her parents, it wasn't people that it would have been an issue anyway, but they were like, let's have some different topics. And she said it was great. The first topic was funeral plans, she said that went for quite a while, and it was quite a fun conversation. And I was like, so sometimes you just need to have, like a. Just throw a curveball in there, find something different or try and you don't have to. Like, especially when it comes to American politics. Like, yes, it affects the world. Yes, it's important, but we actually don't have control over it. [00:53:49] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:53:49] Speaker A: You're not going to change anything by having a rant about it. [00:53:52] Speaker B: No. [00:53:52] Speaker A: Or getting online and posting all your 500 opinion pieces from people that support your opinion and throwing. [00:53:58] Speaker B: You're being robbed of your piece and you're being called into friendship. [00:54:01] Speaker A: Letting it get robbed. And that's not actually a good thing. [00:54:04] Speaker B: Like, that's funny that funeral arrangements was the first topic. [00:54:07] Speaker A: Find a funny meme to post instead. Just move on. Like you can't change it. [00:54:12] Speaker B: I want to be triple masked when I go in that coffin. Yeah, that's a good idea. So actually, because Christmas is coming up, Right. If you're in America, Thanksgiving as well, obviously. And these are, these can be these potential sort of blow it. [00:54:27] Speaker A: Yeah. Ruin everything. [00:54:28] Speaker B: Yeah. They're the big blowout moments. [00:54:30] Speaker A: Boom. [00:54:30] Speaker B: If it all goes off because someone just, you know, throws too many glasses. [00:54:34] Speaker A: Of wine and decides to share their opinion. [00:54:36] Speaker B: Yeah. And this again, sometimes if you have to be the bigger player in the room and actually just wear it. [00:54:41] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:54:42] Speaker B: You might have to just say, oh, yeah, that's interesting. And I've had that, I've had that with in laws, shall we say, where recent conversations. I'm like, okay, they don't have lots of people to talk with about these issues. They're not social media buffs. And so they're just, they're sharing their frustrations and ideas about what they think about a particular policy or politician or thing. And I go, oh, yeah, that's interesting. Yeah, that's interesting. Is it? And I, I might even strongly disagree, but I just, I listen and I, I sort of respond in that way, but I just hold myself. [00:55:12] Speaker A: We should be listening anyway. We should always be making sure that our. Is my opinion well formed? Is there something I haven't thought of? [00:55:20] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:55:20] Speaker A: You know, and it's good to see things from somebody else's perspective. [00:55:24] Speaker B: Yeah, I think it's healthy actually. The key thing is now politics is everywhere. This is what happens when you abandon the sacred, transcendent Christian vision of reality. Then all you have to talk about. The only power source that people fixate on is politics. Who's got power, what are their policies, who's being oppressed, all that kind of stuff. And politics is now just everywhere. It is. And there's lots of reasons for that. If you listen to the dispatches, you get a better appreciation for this. I'm not going to go into that now. But the key point is this. The Christian version of reality is not political. It is relational. And we see politics as yet another form of humans relating together. That's how we order it. So the question is, is the relational vision of reality a priority that you nurture in your family home? It's no good saying, oh, we've got these problems and political views and they're all busting up. If in actual fact all that's happening is you're just disagreeing and not prioritizing genuine relational flourishing in your own home. So you've got to figure out, well, what does that look like? Let's. It might be that, you know, like topics of conversation or Christmas dinner. Let's not just leave massive gaps for huge debates. Let's. Let's do something. Let's go for a walk after, down to the local park and do something. Or let's watch a classic Christmas movie together. So there's. It's not just. You're sort of trying to foster things that will actually. [00:56:42] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:56:43] Speaker B: Bring. [00:56:43] Speaker A: There's way more to talk about in politics. [00:56:45] Speaker B: Yes. Or is there? [00:56:47] Speaker A: Wow. We can make it that way. [00:56:49] Speaker B: Very well said, Katie. Question number two. I find myself frustrated. Oh. But before we move on, actually, is there ever a moment. Is there ever a red line where you would. Would kick someone out or would. [00:57:00] Speaker A: No, not in my family. [00:57:02] Speaker B: I think I'd speak up. I don't. I think that's. That'd be the extent of it. A Christmas dinner. If someone was just over the top, I'd say, look, I think you need to. [00:57:09] Speaker A: It's more likely that I'd remove myself. [00:57:12] Speaker B: Yeah, you would. Whereas my strategy would be say, hey, I think we need to find something else to talk about. [00:57:17] Speaker A: Who wants some pavlova? [00:57:19] Speaker B: Who would like another drink? [00:57:21] Speaker A: Yeah, there's none left for you. [00:57:23] Speaker B: You're too naughty as you throw the plate at the wall. Yeah. So a message received. That's always one, isn't it? The old emotional blackmail. You've hurt me. Okay, second question. I find myself frustrated with the church. What should I do? Yeah, well, that's not an uncommon thing. [00:57:41] Speaker A: Whenever I hear this kind of question, I always think, you don't leave Jesus because of Judas. [00:57:46] Speaker B: Oh, that's. That's a good one. Say that again, please. [00:57:49] Speaker A: I didn't write that myself. [00:57:50] Speaker B: Say that again. [00:57:50] Speaker A: You don't leave Jesus because of Judas. [00:57:52] Speaker B: You don't leave. That's a great one. [00:57:53] Speaker A: So Jesus is where the church is. Hopefully, if you're in a good One. And just because of something that we all get hurt in a myriad of ways. Right. Like, lots of different things happen in churches and because they're full of humans. But just because a human has hurt you, betrayed you, whatever, does not mean you walk away from the church. [00:58:15] Speaker B: Yeah, well, the thing too, is. Let me just, you know, give the spoiler alert here. The church will frustrate you. [00:58:22] Speaker A: Yeah, that's right. [00:58:23] Speaker B: Unless you're not human or you could be a really beautiful saintly person. The church will frustrate you because it's full of human beings who are not yet fully sanctified. They have not attained the sainthood that they will attain in heaven. And so they're fallible. They're like you. So the church will frustrate you. [00:58:41] Speaker A: Also, spoiler alert. You're probably annoying someone as well. [00:58:44] Speaker B: That's it as well. Yeah. So you're thinking you might be someone. [00:58:47] Speaker A: Else'S reason for being frustrated, frustrating. [00:58:49] Speaker B: And they're thinking, that guy is so frustrating. [00:58:51] Speaker A: Why is he here? [00:58:52] Speaker B: All he talks about is how frustrated he is. [00:58:54] Speaker A: You might be someone else's Judas. [00:58:56] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, very good. So, yeah, the church, it will frustrate you. If you think there's a perfect church out there that won't, oh, boy, you're in for a rude awakening and probably a very difficult lifelong journey of desperately searching for El Dorado, the Golden City. The church that is perfect. It doesn't exist. [00:59:18] Speaker A: It's in heaven. [00:59:19] Speaker B: Yeah, it is in heaven. [00:59:20] Speaker A: The Church Triumphant is where you want to be. [00:59:22] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [00:59:23] Speaker A: That's why you feel like there should be an element of frustration because you're not there yet. [00:59:27] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:59:27] Speaker A: And neither is the rest of us. [00:59:28] Speaker B: And it's interesting. So traditionally in Christianity there's. We understand the three spheres of the church as being the Church Triumphant, which is those who have already gone to their eternal reward in heaven. They're with God. They're fully in the life of God. Then there is the Church suffering, and then there is the Church militant. And, you know, the implication, of course, is that we have a certain warfare, our spiritual warfare. This is part of our spiritual warfare. We all like to think it's about, I'm gonna fight the big demons and baphomet and whatever other demon, you know, as a zeal or some other. You know, you've read something somewhere or you've seen in a film. And look, there are moments when exorcisms are required, but they are the exception. The normative spiritual combat you have to go in, into battle with is against your own sinfulness, the various demons that would try and tempt you into your own sinfulness and your own sinful proclivities. Yeah. And to struggle to live like Christ, that's every day powers and principalities. Right. [01:00:26] Speaker A: Yeah. Every day is a new day. I was going to say something wise, but it's gone. [01:00:31] Speaker B: It wasn't about, oh, the perfect church, was it? No. [01:00:35] Speaker A: Maybe. [01:00:36] Speaker B: One thing I was going to say as well is a very good piece of advice my father received from a member of the clergy once was Tom. That was my dad's name. He said, tom, who told you that you worship priests and bishops? You don't. You worship Christ. We follow Christ. We're in relationship with Him. And we put up with our church leaders. [01:00:54] Speaker A: That's right. [01:00:55] Speaker B: And it's the same with two of their fellow congregants. Because guess what? They've got to put up with you. [01:00:58] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. [01:01:00] Speaker B: So, yeah, it is very easy, isn't it? I've been really challenged with that in recent years. My own attitudes where I sort of. I tend to think everyone else has got the problem in the church, but forget that. In actual fact, and this is the key, when you say the Church, don't forget you are part of that body. [01:01:17] Speaker A: That's right. [01:01:19] Speaker B: So I think what you've got to do is you've got to say, okay, I'm part of this as well. So that means probably someone like we. [01:01:24] Speaker A: Talked about finds me situation. Right. [01:01:26] Speaker B: Yeah. And they find me annoying, possibly, or frustrating with me or my behaviors. Not just that, but it is human. So you have to sort of live with that reality as well. And I am part of the church. So if the church has a problem, what am I doing to contribute to Christian goodness, truth and beauty? [01:01:43] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:01:44] Speaker B: And am I taking responsibility and getting proactive in my own little way? Doesn't matter who you are. You can do this to actually create a culture of goodness, truth and beauty around me as opposed to just saying I think the church has got problems or it frustrates me. And I get it. Sometimes the church can really wound people. Well, not the church. People in the church can really wound people. [01:02:08] Speaker A: Absolutely. [01:02:09] Speaker B: And. But I'm so. There are moments where. Yeah. Like it's not. I'm not saying people are imagining this necessarily, but then what does Christ call us to do? He says, pick up your cross. He says, love your enemies. Pray for those who hate you. He doesn't say, look, mate, this is kind of like Friedrich Nietzsche, let's get some power for you. And then you can be the strong man or the strong woman and. No, it's, it's. And that's the hard bit because I'm really terrible at that. [01:02:35] Speaker A: You don't want to get caught up in the if onlys. If only we had, you know, fill in the gap, then everything would be perfect and we'd be happy and holy. [01:02:42] Speaker B: No, no. And I think one thing to ask yourself too, is if you find yourself frustrated, well, what am I actually practically doing to serve the body of Christ? Because that can be a problem. I think where people are frustrated and a lot of that is they're not actually active in any way. So they're on the outside or they're sitting in the stadium seats sniping from the comfort of the seat, but they're not active. And once you do get active and find roles of service. [01:03:10] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:03:10] Speaker B: Then all of a sudden your perspective starts to shift as well. And often that you don't have as much time to. To complain. [01:03:17] Speaker A: Yeah, that's right. And you can. And also once you're in service, you can see more fully. Your eyes are opened a little bit. I think you can see more fully where the struggles are and why those struggles exist. And. And there's less kind of judgment maybe, because you can see, once again, we're all human and. [01:03:35] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:03:35] Speaker A: And things can't be fixed overnight and. [01:03:37] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah, that's great. That's a good point. I think another thing too is an old saying that I love is if you spend more time praying for people, you'll have less time to pray on people. And I think that's true. Like pray and just say, okay, I'm frustrated by this person or this situation. Okay, I'm gonna stop and I'm gonna put myself in the presence of God. What have you got to lose by doing that? [01:03:59] Speaker A: That's right. [01:04:00] Speaker B: I'm discovering more and more of my ministry work and other things where I thought it was all about having, you know, busyness and schedule and control and doing all things off stuff. In actual fact, my ministry has become more fruitful and my discipleship journey has become more life giving simply by stopping and just putting myself in the presence of God. [01:04:19] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:04:20] Speaker B: And. Yeah. And I mean, I think that's something to do as well in those situations. Okay, question number three, Katie, how do you handle end of year stress? [01:04:30] Speaker A: Badly. It's funny. [01:04:32] Speaker B: Eh. Every year I'm like, oh, we'll have a plan next year we're gonna do this. And even six months out, I start to do this and put that in. And then you get there and you're like, it's November. [01:04:43] Speaker A: Who said it could be November? Yeah, we need another month between November and December, please. How do I handle it? But I do think you make a good point there. Have a plan, prioritize. [01:04:55] Speaker B: What would be priority? Like how would you do this? [01:04:57] Speaker A: I asked me about this this morning. [01:04:58] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:04:59] Speaker A: And I thought turn your eyes upon Jesus. And I know that sounds really cheesy. [01:05:05] Speaker B: Come on, you can't just quote song lyrics now. Look, give the people some. [01:05:09] Speaker A: It's in the Bible or something, isn't it? [01:05:11] Speaker B: No, it's not. [01:05:12] Speaker A: It's. [01:05:12] Speaker B: Well, it kind of isn't. [01:05:13] Speaker A: No, but it's that sense of like, how do we handle end of your stress? What is the stress that's at the end of the year? The main one is Christmas, right? [01:05:20] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [01:05:21] Speaker A: That's because it's an extra mental. Especially for mums. [01:05:23] Speaker B: Christmas schooling, if you've got kids. Shutting down. [01:05:26] Speaker A: Yeah. The end is all of the things apparently that we have to do in. [01:05:29] Speaker B: Term four functions, end of year functions. [01:05:31] Speaker A: Yeah. Too many things. Right. And in our family we also leave home quite quickly after Christmas from big ministry event which takes up quite a lot of my time before Christmas. [01:05:42] Speaker B: It's a 10 day summer school. [01:05:43] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:05:44] Speaker B: Christian summer school for 18 to 35 year olds and it's about 120 plus of them each year and yeah, the whole family goes on that journey and. [01:05:51] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. So it's a big commitment for our family and it's also something extra for me amongst everything else in December. It's a beautiful experience, it's beautiful work. But it adds to the stress that. [01:06:02] Speaker B: Ministry has been part of our marriage from well before we were married. So it has a. Yeah. So I was the director for 13 years and then we took a break. I stepped back as the new director, took over and then Katie went back on and is now assisting. [01:06:17] Speaker A: Lady behind the lady. [01:06:18] Speaker B: Yeah, the lady behind the lady. And so yeah, it's been a big. [01:06:22] Speaker A: Part of our beautiful part. But I think that. Yeah, that just popped into my head. Like you have to have Christ as your focus. Christ is the focus of Christmas. Christ is the focus of the work we do after Christmas. And you're planning all those family events. You might be hosting family events. Christ has to be the focus in the center of those as well. And I'm not saying that will take away all the stress, but I think it's keeping that. I know we always say keep Christ in Christmas, you know, but it's True. There's a truth in it, like. Yeah, yeah. If you remember why you're doing it and who it's about. [01:06:54] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:06:55] Speaker A: Then some of the stress is hopefully lessened. [01:06:58] Speaker B: Yeah. I think too sometimes perhaps we create stress where there doesn't need to be stress and sometimes that can be as simple as expectations. And like you think, oh, I've got to put on like the perfect, the best Christmas day meal or you know, we've got to have the best presents and if my kids don't like this particular present, I've failed and we put all this burden on ourselves. [01:07:21] Speaker A: Everybody doesn't have the exact same number of presents. [01:07:23] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:07:25] Speaker A: No. [01:07:26] Speaker B: One thing we were talking about just actually a couple of weeks ago was this idea of, you know, moving more into gifting experiences rather than stuff. And it is kind of true. I was thinking about that, you know, the idea of, well, let's pay for a, you know, a family trip on the local harbor cruise or something like, you know, instead of just everyone gets a whole lot of stuff. [01:07:46] Speaker A: Things. [01:07:46] Speaker B: Yeah. And so, you know, figuring out what, well, what's causing the stress is going to be a factor. I mean, is that we just got too much on what are the actual. [01:07:54] Speaker A: Things you need to prioritize. And you know, keeping a really good diary this time of year I find is really important because there are always events that you don't expect, you don't remember or things change. [01:08:07] Speaker B: Yeah. So, yeah, yeah, that's helpful. I think a little plan does help. One thing I know like our parents generation, you sort of. We used to perhaps have a little chuckle. But they'd be preparing for Christmas presents and cards and stuff like four or five months before Christmas and you're like. [01:08:25] Speaker A: So organized with that. Even now she's. [01:08:27] Speaker B: And we'd sort of have a chuckle. But now I get it. [01:08:29] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:08:29] Speaker B: I really get that. [01:08:30] Speaker A: My mum used to get all the, the mailers that came in the letterbox because, you know, there was no Internet. [01:08:36] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:08:36] Speaker A: So she'd be like circling specials on toys and stuff like months before Christmas, like. [01:08:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:08:41] Speaker A: Trying to get the best deals and. [01:08:43] Speaker B: Yeah, that's funny. Yeah. Yeah. And then, and. But there's a. There is actually a method to that and it actually does help. So. And I think is again, so expectations. Are you placing too many expectations on yourself? Planning. Have a bit of a plan. One thing I found helpful and this is in my ministry work, but in general as well, is I now on the wall behind us here I have two year planners side by side. They're perpetual Year planners, they don't have to be for you, though. But I've got the current year, the whole year laid out and I can see everything. And then the next year as well. And what I found about that is I find it a. It's just more helpful to have the full year laid out in front of me. Like I can actually see not just the next week, but the next couple of months. And that sort of gives you a sense of, oh, you know, here's where I need to perhaps get a bit busier. Here's where I can take a breather or it's not as bad as I think. And also having the next year ahead because I think what happens, particularly as you get to the end of the year, your brain is just in this mode of thinking, we're coming to the end and all you can see is the deadline. [01:09:46] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:09:47] Speaker B: But when you actually look at two calendars side by side, you realize, oh, no, there's more to come. [01:09:52] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:09:53] Speaker B: So maybe it's just a matter of me not trying to do everything right now. If there's something that's happening at the end of January, I don't need to be panicking and trying to do it now before the end of December, unless there's some good reason why, generally. So I can actually come back and halfway through January and deal with that problem. So that possibly in the family setting that might be helpful as well. It's just, you know, and I think just trying to strip out and make time for like this year. We didn't have this last year and it was a bit harder this year. We're going to have a bit of time. It's almost a week between Christmas, so school finishing Christmas and then Christmas and when we have to go away for this ministry work that we do. And so. Well, let's take. Even if it's one day, at least one of those days to go and do something together as a family and just get out of that mode and, you know, take advantage of that time. Don't. Don't fill it up with. [01:10:46] Speaker A: That's right. [01:10:47] Speaker B: Lots of stuff. I remember I did that one year. Was it when we were demolishing the concrete fireplace in the house. Remember that? And I just. [01:10:55] Speaker A: Oh, you went and went. [01:10:56] Speaker B: Yeah. And it was like we had to. We stopped and we decided last week to go to Nelson. Yeah. And I'm glad we did it because. [01:11:03] Speaker A: We keep seeing stuff that needs to. [01:11:04] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And it was just adding to the stress. [01:11:06] Speaker A: So don't add change of center scenery, actually plan that In. [01:11:09] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:11:10] Speaker A: Even if you. If you can't afford a big long week break, even if you get away for three nights. [01:11:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:11:13] Speaker A: Because you just. [01:11:14] Speaker B: Or even a couple of day trips because we're not loaded with. [01:11:16] Speaker A: We'll be doing the same jobs in a different place. [01:11:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:11:19] Speaker A: But there's something about that change of scenery and just stopping and actually not seeing everything that needs to be done at your own house. Yeah. [01:11:25] Speaker B: Yeah. And take advantage of that. Go with the family. Even as. Even it's just day trips and, and, and yeah, like, like we don't have tons of cash to, to splash on holiday stuff, but going away for a trip together one day, just let's go and do this walk in the bush or let's go to the beach or whatever it is. And yeah, it might not even be a full day your way, but that can really just make a big difference. So. So, yeah. And, and when you. Again, if you look at a schedule and you can see that it gives you little way points where you go, ah, right now it's busy and I can't really escape it, but on that day we're going to be getting in the car and we're going to be in Picton or we're going to be at the beach for the day or whatever it is. You know, it's just. Yeah, that's helpful. So, I mean, I guess apart from that, there's sometimes you just got to grin and be. [01:12:13] Speaker A: Yeah. Get through. [01:12:15] Speaker B: Get through and try to. I think, I guess the challenge is how do you stop that manifesting into unhealthy ways and family life. So you're not. I mean, like, what's the point if you are. You spend two or three weeks lashing out at your spouse or your children. [01:12:31] Speaker A: And I think that is something for a spouse to be aware of. Like, I would appreciate if Brendan's aware that Katie might be feeling quite a big burden at the moment with everything that's going on to actually, if he notices and doesn't just go, why are you so grumpy? But says, hey, what's. Actually. What's driving this grumpiness? [01:12:51] Speaker B: Yeah. What. [01:12:51] Speaker A: Can I take off your plate? Or can we. Can we drop something? [01:12:54] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:12:55] Speaker A: Are you trying to do too much? And not in like a. You've chosen to do too much, you silly woman. But like a. [01:13:00] Speaker B: Well, and sometimes you've got to negotiate that madness together because I know for you there's a stress and a particular type of stress that associated with the Christmas Day meal. We've. We've just the circumstances we often end up hosting. We're the sort of in the position where for whatever reason, we won't go into all the details, but it just tends to happen. [01:13:16] Speaker A: It's worked out for the best. [01:13:18] Speaker B: Us and one of my. My sister. We sort of share it and. But it is kind of a stressful thing. Katie feels a particular type of stress. It's different from other stress that you have around that thing. And I'm a bit more chilled out. I'm like, just people here. We have some food, we'll have some Christmas fun and a few drinks. It'll be lovely, you know, and. Whereas Katie's like, no, but this, this is. And she sees a particular type, feels a particular type of stress. I'm getting a funny look. So where's this going after this next month's question, how do you handle a situation where you've upset your wife during a podcast? We'll know where that question's coming from. But, yeah, so we had to sort of negotiate our way through it and I'm like, well, what if we did a barbecue? Or what if we did this? And you were like, no. And because you're feeling a particular type of stress and I've just got to sort of navigate that. It's just. And then the negotiation and the navigation, you get a solution at the end of it, you know, you just. And. And it's funny how sometimes that can be the one point. Yeah, it might just be one particular point of stress in the busyness that's the problem. And we think it's everything, but it's just. Oh, it's just the Christmas Day thing that's the real stressful factor. Or it's the present buying or. And if you can solve that or help with that in some way, then everything else suddenly. Yeah, falls into line. So, yes, I look forward to our conversation in a few moments, folks. Thanks again for tuning in. Don't forget, if you want to send us your questions to discuss on future episodes, go to thelittleflockpodcast.org or lifenet.org nz@the top of the page on both of those pages, you'll find a clickable link to do that. Also, don't forget, if you want to support our work, you can do that by becoming a patron with any amount. At patreon.com leftfootmedia you can now gift Patreon subscriptions as well to other people. Or you can go to lifenet.org nz and become a donor. Again, a huge thank you to all of our donors. Those people who partner with us in this important ministry work. You are such a blessing to us and it's thanks to you. Like we. I really feel just overwhelmed at times. It is such a blessing to be able to serve the church in this way and the wider culture of New Zealand and. Yeah. So thank you for your support and your partnership with us in this ministry work. Katie, next month I was thinking, well, it's December. [01:15:28] Speaker A: Yes, it is. [01:15:28] Speaker B: Speaking of stress, let's add some more stress. Let's have another episode. But I was thinking maybe we might even try and bring the kids in. [01:15:33] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. [01:15:34] Speaker B: And have a Christmas conversation. Find some things to talk about and, you know, whether it be favourite Christmas movies or, you know, favorite Christmas activities and pastimes and stuff. But yeah, we might do that. [01:15:46] Speaker A: Cool. [01:15:47] Speaker B: Have some eggnog. Put a log on the floor. Some special kids. No. Yeah, we're not funny. It's a tradition in America, but only some parts of America, I think, isn't it? [01:15:57] Speaker A: I think England it came from. [01:15:58] Speaker B: Did it? [01:15:59] Speaker A: I don't know. Look up the origins of eggnog next episode. [01:16:03] Speaker B: Yeah, I'd love to know. It's probably some reason it was a health food or something. Probably. Anyway, I think that's all we want to say, isn't it? Do you. Do you have any other pearls of wisdom that you would like to. [01:16:13] Speaker A: Tapped out of wisdom. [01:16:14] Speaker B: Now I'm done. See you next month. That's all the wisdom I've got left. So thanks again, folks, for tuning in. Don't forget, live by goodness, truth and beauty, not by lies. And we'll see you next time on the Little Flock. [01:16:26] Speaker A: See you then. The Little Flock is a joint production of the Life Net Charitable Trust and Left Foot Media. [01:16:40] Speaker B: If you enjoyed this show, then please help us to ensure that more of this great content keeps getting made by becoming a patron of the [email protected] leftfootmedia thanks for listening. [01:16:53] Speaker A: See you next time on the Little Flock.